Update 58 Discussion

531 posts · 2008-02-21 13:15:07 to 2008-03-06 09:17:49

#36300412385 02/22/2008 13:27:08 Update 58 Discussion
shearman wrote:
I love most of what is here. I know it's minuscule, but I liked the AFK message thing. Keeps people from constantly spamming you tells when your AFK. But, still a great update. <3 the email thing.
I think it meant it won't send them your afk message if you just sent them a message. Not that normally a person sending you a tell won't get a message.



Also, the blue rez thing...first, people acting as if this wasn't big obviously don't read the forums much...it's been complained about for a long time. Also, I'm pretty sure /release is the same as /reconstruct or clicking reconstruct. You can't unflag yourself is what I think it's saying. Or /release reconstructs you but takes the flag off? I dunno. Probably just means your flag doesn't disappear until you reconstruct, so that rezzes will flag the rezzer.
#36300412392 02/22/2008 13:44:07 Re:Update 58 Discussion
exsuscito wrote:
exsuscito wrote:

The manner in which the flagged-recon section is worded is confusing.  Let me get this straight:

If you accept a res, you will still be flagged.  If you recon and come back immediately, you will still be flagged.  That is, until the usual five minute timer wears off. 

To not be flagged, you have to type /release before recon'ing or accepting the res?


I think that the rule is when you die you will remain flagged until you reconstruct.  If you accept a rez instead of reconstructing, you will revive flagged as hostile and the person who rezzed you will also flag as hostile.

I think "/release" is actually just the command for reconstructing.

#36300412408 02/22/2008 14:05:28 Re:Update 58 Discussion


The missing pipe ends are due to another old texture that was never put in the copy of the resources that are actually in Live. Thought I had this taken care of along with the other one yesterday, but the integration on this one didn't happen. I think we'll probably just end up shipping with this one (and fixing it in a follow-up update), if no actual showstoppers crop up in testing today...

#36300412413 02/22/2008 14:09:58 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Garu wrote:
exsuscito wrote:
exsuscito wrote:

The manner in which the flagged-recon section is worded is confusing.  Let me get this straight:

If you accept a res, you will still be flagged.  If you recon and come back immediately, you will still be flagged.  That is, until the usual five minute timer wears off. 

To not be flagged, you have to type /release before recon'ing or accepting the res?


I think that the rule is when you die you will remain flagged until you reconstruct.  If you accept a rez instead of reconstructing, you will revive flagged as hostile and the person who rezzed you will also flag as hostile.

I think "/release" is actually just the command for reconstructing.


Rare.  Whilst you're on could you possibly clear this up?
#36300412415 02/22/2008 14:11:00 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Just as long as it's out on Monday. SMILEY
#36300412429 02/22/2008 14:30:46 Re:Update 58 Discussion
exsuscito wrote:
Garu wrote:
exsuscito wrote:
exsuscito wrote:

The manner in which the flagged-recon section is worded is confusing.  Let me get this straight:

If you accept a res, you will still be flagged.  If you recon and come back immediately, you will still be flagged.  That is, until the usual five minute timer wears off. 

To not be flagged, you have to type /release before recon'ing or accepting the res?


I think that the rule is when you die you will remain flagged until you reconstruct.  If you accept a rez instead of reconstructing, you will revive flagged as hostile and the person who rezzed you will also flag as hostile.

I think "/release" is actually just the command for reconstructing.


Rare.  Whilst you're on could you possibly clear this up?
Tch. I'm always on.

Anyway I'll have to ask Dracomet, because I don't know for sure. I think what you've got there is probably right, though.

#36300412431 02/22/2008 14:32:12 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Rarebit wrote:
exsuscito wrote:
Garu wrote:
exsuscito wrote:
exsuscito wrote:

The manner in which the flagged-recon section is worded is confusing.  Let me get this straight:

If you accept a res, you will still be flagged.  If you recon and come back immediately, you will still be flagged.  That is, until the usual five minute timer wears off. 

To not be flagged, you have to type /release before recon'ing or accepting the res?


I think that the rule is when you die you will remain flagged until you reconstruct.  If you accept a rez instead of reconstructing, you will revive flagged as hostile and the person who rezzed you will also flag as hostile.

I think "/release" is actually just the command for reconstructing.


Rare.  Whilst you're on could you possibly clear this up?
Tch. I'm always on.

Anyway I'll have to ask Dracomet, because I don't know for sure. I think what you've got there is probably right, though.

Yep, you guys had it right.

#36300412432 02/22/2008 14:37:05 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Perhaps I'm missing something, but what's the benefit of being res'd still flagged on non-hostile servers?  Is it to facilitate the res'er flagging, also?
#36300412443 02/22/2008 14:45:54 Re:Update 58 Discussion
exsuscito wrote:
Perhaps I'm missing something, but what's the benefit of being res'd still flagged on non-hostile servers?  Is it to facilitate the res'er flagging, also?
So that you don't just pop back up and get free hitsies on someone, would be my guess.

#36300412446 02/22/2008 14:53:32 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Rarebit wrote:
exsuscito wrote:
Perhaps I'm missing something, but what's the benefit of being res'd still flagged on non-hostile servers?  Is it to facilitate the res'er flagging, also?
So that you don't just pop back up and get free hitsies on someone, would be my guess.



If you accept a res and jump back up still flagged, a nearby Spy will have a free punt wrapped in a gold ribbon in front of their very eyes.  Res seems to have been neutralised. 

Did you just say 'hitsies'?

#36300412447 02/22/2008 14:53:59 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Rarebit wrote:
exsuscito wrote:
Perhaps I'm missing something, but what's the benefit of being res'd still flagged on non-hostile servers?  Is it to facilitate the res'er flagging, also?
So that you don't just pop back up and get free hitsies on someone, would be my guess.

Yep. On a non-hostile server "blue rezzing" broke the entire ebb/flow of combat, and caused there to be no down time, resulting in no feeling of accomplishment, diminishing the actual enjoyability of PVP.
#36300412451 02/22/2008 14:57:45 Re:Update 58 Discussion

Dear Devs, good job on finally making the PvP flagging change to rezzers, I guess. Should have been done years ago, but you're finally doing it nontheless.

I must ask, Why Now? And why isn't there a line in the notes that says, "we apologize to stolk for this change taking so long."?

And to that one crybaby, if you wanna stand around and do nothing, don't rez anyone. Problem then solved. PvP then better.

#36300412456 02/22/2008 15:01:20 Re:Update 58 Discussion
(Missing the point 'ftw', as they say.)
#36300412459 02/22/2008 15:02:31 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Virrago wrote:

PvP Flagging Changes

  • Players no longer lose their PvP flag on death. It will still time out as normal after death, and is removed by /release and reconstruct.
  • Using abilities such as Revive RSI on a flagged dead player will flag you if the dead player accepts.*
  • Dead players' nametags (with org and flag shown, if they are flagged) will now be displayed when they are targeted.

* We apologize to Stolk for this change taking so long.


Fixed for Stolk.  <3
#36300412461 02/22/2008 15:03:51 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Take it easy, guys. Everyone's entitled to an opinion as long as they can express it without shooting someone else's e-feelings out.

Also, we'll have plenty more controversial/noteworthy build notes coming along in a supplemental list later this afternoon/evening...

#36300412462 02/22/2008 15:05:34 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Rarebit wrote:

Also, we'll have plenty more controversial/noteworthy build notes coming along in a supplemental list later this afternoon/evening...



Rarebit + ellipses = tease.
#36300412463 02/22/2008 15:07:04 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Rarebit wrote:
Take it easy, guys. Everyone's entitled to an opinion as long as they can express it without shooting someone else's e-feelings out.

Also, we'll have plenty more controversial/noteworthy build notes coming along in a supplemental list later this afternoon/evening...


Oooooo... bonus patch notes? SMILEY
#36300412464 02/22/2008 15:10:48 Re:Update 58 Discussion
controversial/noteworthy = very very good, or very very bad SMILEY
#36300412467 02/22/2008 15:15:44 Re:Update 58 Discussion
SolidRevolver wrote:
controversial/noteworthy = very very good, or very very bad SMILEY" />
That's why they're controversial. =p
#36300412471 02/22/2008 15:20:42 Re:Update 58 Discussion
ZippyTheSquirrel wrote:
SolidRevolver wrote:
controversial/noteworthy = very very good, or very very bad SMILEY<img src=">
That's why they're controversial. =p

Yeah, I am just worried because is what awesome notes we have now a sign of things to come, or are the awesome notes we have a balance of things to come SMILEY
#36300412472 02/22/2008 15:24:27 Re:Update 58 Discussion
SolidRevolver wrote:
ZippyTheSquirrel wrote:
SolidRevolver wrote:
controversial/noteworthy = very very good, or very very bad SMILEY<img src=">
That's why they're controversial. =p

Yeah, I am just worried because is what awesome notes we have now a sign of things to come, or are the awesome notes we have a balance of things to come SMILEY" width="15" height="15" />

ok, now you've officially made me skeered. SMILEY
#36300412476 02/22/2008 15:38:19 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Phluff wrote:
SolidRevolver wrote:
ZippyTheSquirrel wrote:
SolidRevolver wrote:
controversial/noteworthy = very very good, or very very bad SMILEY<img src=">
That's why they're controversial. =p

Yeah, I am just worried because is what awesome notes we have now a sign of things to come, or are the awesome notes we have a balance of things to come SMILEY<img src=" width="15" height="15">

ok, now you've officially made me skeered. SMILEY

Yeah... I tend to have that affect on people SMILEY

No point listening though, I thought the new area was a new district SMILEY

#36300412479 02/22/2008 15:57:33 Re:Update 58 Discussion
hmm...so you were hiding more from us then? I guess extra testing time truly is ftw then

EDIT: also...I'm wondering who's doing the posting of the extra build notes? Th3 Wa1rus perhaps?
#36300412523 02/22/2008 17:21:24 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Controversial change number 1
-Instead of AFK activating, Zane will auto flag and it will say Attack Now instead of AFK.
#36300412530 02/22/2008 17:38:39 Re:Update 58 Discussion

Controversial change number 2
-Mervs and Mechs get a level 100 spawn of there own

Yeah right SMILEY

#36300412533 02/22/2008 17:42:17 Update 58 Discussion
An AI bug causing patrolling mission NPCs to leave the mission area and navigate to 0, 0, 0 has been fixed.

OMG
#36300412534 02/22/2008 17:42:27 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Whoa:

- Hyper-Deflect can no longer be used at the same time as the other three Hyper- abilities.

Didn't see that one coming.


EDIT:
An AI bug causing patrolling mission NPCs to leave the mission area and navigate to 0, 0, 0 has been fixed.

!!!!!!!!! /bigcheer   =D
#36300412535 02/22/2008 17:42:32 Re:Update 58 Discussion
- Hyper-Deflect can no longer be used at the same time as the other three Hyper- abilities

O_O

#36300412536 02/22/2008 17:43:02 Re:Update 58 Discussion

Hyper-Deflect: That's fair.

NPC 0-0-0 fix: Oh, good god YES.

#36300412537 02/22/2008 17:44:37 Re:Update 58 Discussion
That hyper deflect change is just daft.....

Now along with the other hypers, it makes group pvp just suicidal. Defense against one thing, and get raped by everything else.....


#36300412539 02/22/2008 17:47:12 Re:Update 58 Discussion

- An AI bug causing patrolling mission NPCs to leave the mission area and navigate to 0, 0, 0 has been fixed.

Sexy enough to join S9!  SMILEY
 
- Hyper-Deflect can no longer be used at the same time as the other three Hyper- abilities.

... hmm, I'd rather see it as we could use any two Hypers we chose, now we can only use 1... also, I have to go through all my load outs now as I have them /saveloed >_<

Darkhawk's Gallery | Section 9's Past | Metal Gear?! It's already active?!
There can only be room for one Snake, and one Big Boss!
#36300412540 02/22/2008 17:47:40 Re:Update 58 Discussion
*CENSORED* kinda improvement is hyper defect no longer working with hyper dodge/block/sense. Make it so sense and Deflect are linked together so you can only have one of them on at a time. Way to bust up something that was working fine. PvP just got really stupid.
#36300412542 02/22/2008 17:48:08 Re:Update 58 Discussion
- Hyper-Deflect can no longer be used at the same time as the other three Hyper- abilities.

That sucks! Ugh now hackers are even more powerful...
#36300412543 02/22/2008 17:49:03 Re:Update 58 Discussion
I should mention that there still may be other things that cause NPCs to get lost and wander to 0, 0, 0. If that turns up again we'd need some good reports from you guys on exactly where, what mission you were running, and so forth. Hopefully it was just the one cause that was the problem, but we can't be sure.

#36300412544 02/22/2008 17:49:43 Re:Update 58 Discussion
AltDimension wrote:
- Hyper-Deflect can no longer be used at the same time as the other three Hyper- abilities.

That sucks! Ugh now hackers are even more powerful...
Not something I think should of been done... should of made Hyper Sense stack with Hyper Block or Dodge imo.
#36300412546 02/22/2008 17:51:57 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Slowly, we return to the original combat system.
I must say, this is not a very good add-on. Hackers are fine the way they are, now you can only defend against whomever you're in interlock with.
I question this update now, as I believe just about everyone will go Hacker and/or Spy again.
Just my 2 cents on the subject, I won't argue the point.

However, the NPCs not taking a stroll anymore will be a plus.
But having to refigure out the new changes on the abilities, that'll be a pain.
#36300412549 02/22/2008 17:52:22 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Gerik wrote:
AltDimension wrote:
- Hyper-Deflect can no longer be used at the same time as the other three Hyper- abilities.

That sucks! Ugh now hackers are even more powerful...
Not something I think should of been done... should of made Hyper Sense stack with Hyper Block or Dodge imo.
Yeah that would have been good too. But TBH I think everyone is happy the way it stack already.
#36300412550 02/22/2008 17:53:20 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Make it work like Armored and Shielded clothing. Block can't be on when Dodge is on, Sense can't be on when Deflect is on. God what a stupid idea.
#36300412551 02/22/2008 17:53:21 Re:Update 58 Discussion

I don't see the issue.  Hackers were stripped of their all-conquering prowess in CR2, so it made little sense to enable Deflect to run along with any other Hyper.  Now you just have to keep your wits about you and switch where applicable, just as you would if you find yourself versus a knifer after a gunman, for example.

Edit: I can see what everyone's saying, and I do anticipate a hail of DOT's in the coming days.  I also think it'll level out, however.

#36300412552 02/22/2008 17:53:24 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Travi wrote:
Slowly, we return to the original combat system.

CR3.0 in 2009?  SMILEY
Darkhawk's Gallery | Section 9's Past | Metal Gear?! It's already active?!
There can only be room for one Snake, and one Big Boss!
#36300412553 02/22/2008 17:53:48 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Pretty much what everyone else is saying about the change, Hyper Sense and Deflect should have been linked together.
#36300412555 02/22/2008 17:55:09 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Yeah, I think it should've always been Deflect/Sense + Dodge/Block (choice of the 2)...I'm a little curious to see how this will impact PvP now...heck, even PvE to a degree.
#36300412556 02/22/2008 17:56:50 Re:Update 58 Discussion
exsuscito wrote:
I don't see the issue.  Hackers were stripped of their all-conquering prowess in CR2, so it made little sense to enable Deflect to run along with any other Hyper.  Now you just have to keep your wits about you and switch where applicable, just as you would if you find yourself versus a knifer after a gunmen, for example.

I'd like to see you efficiently switch between all 4 defenses when you're getting zerged. Hacker was working just fine in CR2, it's balanced unlike CR1 hacker. Now it just means you're definitely more likely to get hit by hack after hack while you're in interlock with an MA  or gunman or mkt, and getting owned by the rest of the other trees just because you can only have one hyper activated.
#36300412557 02/22/2008 17:57:38 Re:Update 58 Discussion
massive fail =(
#36300412558 02/22/2008 17:58:00 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Hm... Maybe we could just combine them all into one ability called "Hyper-Win"?

#36300412561 02/22/2008 17:58:58 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Brommerz77 wrote:
exsuscito wrote:
I don't see the issue.  Hackers were stripped of their all-conquering prowess in CR2, so it made little sense to enable Deflect to run along with any other Hyper.  Now you just have to keep your wits about you and switch where applicable, just as you would if you find yourself versus a knifer after a gunmen, for example.

I'd like to see you efficiently switch between all 4 defenses when you're getting zerged. Hacker was working just fine in CR2, it's balanced unlike CR1 hacker. Now it just means you're definitely more likely to get hit by hack after hack while you're in interlock with an MA  or gunman or mkt, and getting owned by the rest of the other trees just because you can only have one hyper activated.

I completely understand that perspective, but just as clearly as I can see one in which choosing IL has now become more of a pertinent tactic.  It does make IL more of a deathtrap, that's for sure.
#36300412562 02/22/2008 18:00:15 Re:Update 58 Discussion
Oh, also QA has approved the update for release, and deployment is set for Monday.

#36300412563 02/22/2008 18:00:28 Re:Update 58 Discussion

Or you could a Viral Defense buff from another player if its so much trouble...

But /shurg pardon me while I dodge the falling pieces of the sky.