Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

#35500000233 03/14/2006 12:56:25 Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

Just what the title says really. These guys have the ability to heal themselves perpetually, and the 'Hostile Code 3.0' ability still does around 3-500 damage a pop. With all the buffs and everything else activated these guys can tank far, far better than any MA. Hopefully Revolt will come on and tell us exactly what he did to avoid dying once over a three hour period flagged for PvP; but I'm not too hopeful on that score SMILEY

I'm sure that there's weaknesses, but from what I've seen even two MAs, and MA and a Hacker, and an MA and a gunman can't take one Utility Master Combo down. And that seems rather unbalanced to me.

#35500000234 03/14/2006 14:19:26 Re: Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

Ha yea I agree. I'm not the greatest PvPer but me and others could barely touch the force enhencers or utility masters. We'd literally fight for ages and get them down to half health and then they'd heal themselves instantely and buff themselves up making it easy to kill us.

This was serious over powering and not just "find their weakness"

#35500000235 03/14/2006 16:26:03 Re: Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

not enough memory.......i tried it and you cant get both force enhancer in the patcher tree and utility master in the coder tree all loaded

#35500000236 03/14/2006 17:45:19 Re: Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

The health regen you can get with stacking Fast Healing 1.0 and Fast Healing 2.0 is rediculous. Its one reason why they are so hard to kill but if you hit them with Cancel Upgrade 2.0 they are screwed.

#35500000237 03/14/2006 23:44:57 Re: Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

Renesis13B wrote:
The health regen you can get with stacking Fast Healing 1.0 and Fast Healing 2.0 is rediculous. Its one reason why they are so hard to kill but if you hit them with Cancel Upgrade 2.0 they are screwed.

Ooooookay that's good to know. I don't think those two abilities are supposed to stack. :\

#35500000238 03/15/2006 00:03:53 Re: Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

With just Trauma Surgeon/FM, one-on-one fights were taking about 10mins. I'd end up dieing beacuse of near-zero DPS, but it took forever to get me down.

I can see things akin to the old CT-overload builds comming back up which = bad.

#35500000239 03/15/2006 03:23:02 Re: Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

Wait, what the hell was I thinking? It's UPGRADE masters and Force Enhancer / Doc combos SMILEY

If any mod wants to edit the title, feel free SMILEY

#35500000240 03/15/2006 03:36:48 Re: Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

RockyB wrote:
Wait, what the hell was I thinking? It's UPGRADE masters and Force Enhancer / Doc combos

If any mod wants to edit the title, feel free

lol rocky thats better,

@ devs....please do not make the fast healings unstackable, as that means alot of memory is wasted in loading abilities that cant be used.....we already cant stack CT(or whatever it is now) with combat aura 1+2 and combat tacics

stacking fast healings is the only chance that the patchers have of attempting to stay alive in interlock with an operative...as by the time they have got round to withdrawing from combat they are done to under 1/2 health anyway and thats just 1v1 combat

/offtopic
something i dont quite like about cr2.0 is it increases the power of the zerg, viral attacks have been nerfed so they do less damage (i dont mind less damage) but the times have been hugely incresed, so instead of standing still for 5seconds and being shot at while casting abilities your there for 10, this will probably deter people from using hacker as the timers are too long, the damage is right but timers are not

#35500000241 03/15/2006 04:24:09 Re: Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

First of all I had a Upgrade Master / Doctor combo. SMILEY

Second, my attribute distribution was a typical MA distribution; meaning I had 22 belief, 22 focus and 24 vitality, therefore I had to focus on my strengths of my attribute distribution, meaning that I had to use Harmfull Code 2.0/3.0 cause I got big bonuses to viral damage. That doesn't mean that Harmfull Code in general is too overpowered. Not every UM / Doc combo will do the same viral damage as I did. Just a reminder. SMILEY

Third, because of my high vitality (24), I got BIG bonuses to my health regen rate, and max health upgrades. Not every UM / Doct combo will have the same bonuses from vitality as I had. That's why I healed so fast, cause of my vitality. SMILEY

Fourth, I'm not sure if the two health regen upgrades are not supposed to stack, cause in live they do stack. But what do I, poor soul, know. SMILEY

Fifth, I can ASSURE you that I had big weaknesses. The only thing was, not many were able to figure them out. SMILEY

I fell prone to some who got it, but others still used the wrong damage ty... ah, wait, I shouldn't help you... SMILEY

Sixth, >revolt_

#35500000242 03/15/2006 05:59:59 Re: Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

*Loads Knife Thrower*

Bring it on SMILEY

#35500000243 03/15/2006 06:04:18 Re: Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

See? It's not overpowered...

Dangit, should have kept quiet... SMILEY

>revolt_

#35500000244 03/15/2006 07:41:24 Re: Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

HCFrog wrote:

Renesis13B wrote:
The health regen you can get with stacking Fast Healing 1.0 and Fast Healing 2.0 is rediculous. Its one reason why they are so hard to kill but if you hit them with Cancel Upgrade 2.0 they are screwed.

Ooooookay that's good to know. I don't think those two abilities are supposed to stack. :\

They always have Frog, supposed too or not they always have. Personally the Comabt enhanvement and combat aura 1.0 just sickening how much mote accuray you get from these 2 buffs.

I only assume it's meant to work this way but if I acm buffed by Combat Enhancement accuracy granted seems to be influenced by my stats so +26pts can easily become +38pts, and what about combat aura 1.0 + 65pts ? come on really Frog how is that balanced. I understadn that the purpose is to get buffed by these guys and be deadly, but jsut how deadly ?

As it is we alreqady have player sacrifing all the awakened abilitys to load a partial MA tree, and combat aura 1.0 - heck why not... they can't be phased in interlock, who needs damage resistance when 65+pts in accuracy means you never get hit.

Please re-consider the ammount of , and level of the upgrades provided by the Patcher abilities, many of them seem abnormally powerful.

-Jilted

#35500000245 03/15/2006 09:13:11 Re: Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

Just a quick note, as this is the easiest place to put it. Bolster health 1.0 is bugged, because Movement Accelerator 1.0 still lists it as a pre-requisite. Hence it is impossible to load up the patcher tree without having to have bolster health 1.0 as well. It's a waste of memory, and rather annoying.

#35500000246 03/15/2006 10:21:53 Re: Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

Jilted_1 wrote:
who needs damage resistance when 65+pts in accuracy means you never get hit.

Just a clarification; +65 pts in accuracy doesn't mean that you never get hit. It does mean that you will hit more often. Your defense score, stays the same.

>revolt_

#35500000247 03/15/2006 12:47:27 Re: Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

shauntaylor88 wrote:

@ devs....please do not make the fast healings unstackable, as that means alot of memory is wasted in loading abilities that cant be used.....we already cant stack CT(or whatever it is now) with combat aura 1+2 and combat tacics

stacking fast healings is the only chance that the patchers have of attempting to stay alive in interlock with an operative...as by the time they have got round to withdrawing from combat they are done to under 1/2 health anyway and thats just 1v1 combat

Isn't that really how a support class such as FM/UM should be anyway? They shouldn't be able to stand up in 1v1 interlocked combat, especially with anyone from the operative tree.

/offtopic
something i dont quite like about cr2.0 is it increases the power of the zerg, viral attacks have been nerfed so they do less damage (i dont mind less damage) but the times have been hugely incresed, so instead of standing still for 5seconds and being shot at while casting abilities your there for 10, this will probably deter people from using hacker as the timers are too long, the damage is right but timers are not
Isn't this also a good thing? Offensive hackers are also a support class. Fewer hackers=better fights. One of the reasons they are doing CR2.0. Everyone was a hacker because it was the easiest way to quickly kill. I would be ecstatic if they pushed the delete key on the entire hacker tree, except for maybe doctor, and even then get rid of the buffs on the doctor tree other than healing and rezzing. You hackers better be glad it's not my decision :smileywink:

#35500000248 03/16/2006 03:39:03 Re: Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

well dude i for one am glad its not your decision

(1) well if you cant go through mssions as an upgrade master or force enhancer then there is seriousley something wrong with the game as what if nobody wants to mission with you - then you are pretty much screwed as you cant solo a mission (example - you walk into an "easy" mission area and get insta killed)

(2) the game is about class diversity and i know hacker is overpowered and that is why im glad to see a leveling of the playing field with cr2. But where do all you kung fu addicts get off saying that they should delete the tree altogether except for doctor in effect you are saying to anybody who wants to be a hacker that you can go do some other tree unlees you want to be bored out of your mind rezzing and healing me because your tree is nerfed

(3)now imaging this scenario - my finger hovering over the delete button of the operative tree.

#35500000249 03/16/2006 05:34:56 Re: Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

If there were to be a bare minimum to doctor there would still be plenty of memory slots to load most of proxy coder or lots of the operative tree so you could still be more useful than rezzing and healing.
They aren't going to delete the hacker tree anyway, so no need to worry. I was just living in a fantastical dream world for a moment.
If for some miracle they do delete the hacker tree, 100 people get upset. If you delete the operative tree, 1000 quit the game.
My opinion is quite different than your opinion. When in Rome.....agree to disagree. :smileyhappy:

#35500000250 03/16/2006 13:02:42 Re: Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

seiphroth wrote:
(3)now imaging this scenario - my finger hovering over the delete button of the operative tree.

Now there's a brilliant idea, a game based on the matrix trilogy, with no martial arts or gun combat wich the movies were built around. It's pretty easy to imagine MxO with only the operative tree's as it would actually be more like the movies.

You remove the operative tree you might as well remove the matrix from the name.

#35500000251 03/16/2006 14:18:44 Re: Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

HCFrog wrote:

Renesis13B wrote:
The health regen you can get with stacking Fast Healing 1.0 and Fast Healing 2.0 is rediculous. Its one reason why they are so hard to kill but if you hit them with Cancel Upgrade 2.0 they are screwed.

Ooooookay that's good to know. I don't think those two abilities are supposed to stack. :\

Been that way for ages in live Senor Frog... been using it for ages... guess my 462% health regen LO on live is going to hit the can... it was fun while it lasted =(

#35500000254 03/18/2006 08:04:17 Re: Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

Well I have no problems with a 'tank' build that can heal.

Just make it so it is terrible in combat. That was the intent to begin with SMILEY

#35500000255 03/18/2006 09:30:12 Re: Patchers: Utility Master / Force Enhancer? Combos - Darn near unbeatable

Electrify wrote:

If for some miracle they do delete the hacker tree, 100 people get upset. If you delete the operative tree, 1000 quit the game.

erm, if you delete the hacker tree, there wont be any zions in recursion. :smileywink: