Balance Out PvP - Hypers Related

At the moment we have a 1 v 1 combat system. Each fight can tend to be quite close which is a good thing but when it comes round to pvp, 1 extra person makes all the difference. If i'm interlocked along with a hacker and a gunner comes along, I'm dead. If its an MA and a MKT or hacker comes along, I'm dead.

We all know that the system can handle having 2 hypers loaded at a time. Fair enough it was unfair on hackers that it was Deflect that was always running but to be honest, in order to try and balance pvp a bit (instead of numbers = win) we need the 2.

One way I'v thought about it is we've got Shielded and Armoured clothing, try and get the coding along the lines of that. i.e. only 1 hyper per side can be loaded at a time. This would mean you would have the choice between dodge or block and deflect or sense.

I just really want to see a 2nd hyper cause you can't really do anything if you're only defending against 1 out of 4 trees.

I really wasn't going to post anything but perhaps the multifighting ability can be used for allowing two hypers being activated. It's been said before in the Sharpshooter/Multifighting thread. Obviously the problem with it is the accessibility by Hackers and Coders.

Numbers are always going to = win though at equal levels.

Yeah Tenshi thats what i try and do but at 20IS a hyper change, it can guzzle up your IS quite a bit.

Yeah the multifighting/sharpshooter could be changed to allow something.

Its MA's that seem to suffer the most with this. We need interlock in order to try and kill but then having 2 knifers appear and spam away, there really ain't anything you can do  (ok the other night i just managed to beat the MA and then escape the knifer )

A change with the hypers could possibly let the underdogs win (depending how good they are etc.) Its just a bit unbalanced the fact you can only defend against a 1/4 of attacks at any one possible time.

Multifighting is garbage and should simply remain that way. If you wanna suggest going back to allowing 2 hypers to be active at a time, then suggest it... But dont add stipulations that force people to go down the operative tree just to be able to get the same defense as someone who is actually loaded out with operative trees. I mean basically the suggestion here is like rolling back to what we had in CR1 where you had to go down the hacker tree's to get your viral deflect up. Forcing a hacker/coder down the operative trees to get their defense will serve no other purpose but to gimp those classes.

Multifighting is garbage and should simply remain that way. If you wanna suggest going back to allowing 2 hypers to be active at a time, then suggest it... But dont add stipulations that force people to go down the operative tree just to be able to get the same defense as someone who is actually loaded out with operative trees. I mean basically the suggestion here is like rolling back to what we had in CR1 where you had to go down the hacker tree's to get your viral deflect up. Forcing a hacker/coder down the operative trees to get their defense will serve no other purpose but to gimp those classes.

I suggest 1 of 3 things be done.

Hear meh out cause I'm super serial.

1. Give 1 ability in each of the MA trees a AOE, these AOEs could be activated and take about 30 IS per 4 seconds.

Kung Fu AOE causes powerless 5 seconds.

Karate AOE causes Stun 5 seconds.

Aikido AOE causes Slow 5 seconds.

Each one drains IS and you can only have 1 on at a time.

I feel these abilities would give MA's a slightly higher chance to fight groups in pvp, now mind you the range on the AOE wouldn't be the big but it might help out alittle bit.

2. Keep the exsisting hyper abilities, but Add a new one, call it Iron Clad Defense. This ability would drain the users IS about 15 IS per 10 seconds and would buff all the defenses by around 50-60. This way you could have the hyper abilities that don't take IS but if you are faced with alot of different trees and styles you can defend ageinst them all for as long as you IS can hold out.

3. Make all of the hyper abilities Passive so as long as you have them loaded, they all are active. Simple and effective.

I wouldn't say under Determination, prob something a bit like need 2 of 4 hypers loaded in order to load it.

Good ideas so far, Skull I really like your ones (especially no. 1. Ki Burst etc could do that )

I wouldn't say under Determination, prob something a bit like need 2 of 4 hypers loaded in order to load it.

AnXieTy wrote:

Multifighting is garbage and should simply remain that way. If you wanna suggest going back to allowing 2 hypers to be active at a time, then suggest it... But dont add stipulations that force people to go down the operative tree just to be able to get the same defense as someone who is actually loaded out with operative trees. I mean basically the suggestion here is like rolling back to what we had in CR1 where you had to go down the hacker tree's to get your viral deflect up. Forcing a hacker/coder down the operative trees to get their defense will serve no other purpose but to gimp those classes.

Multifighting as an ability is useless at the moment, but no it shouldn't stay that way. What is garbage is having an ability that does nothing, it should be utilised for something or removed completely. Besides If you had bothered to read the post then you would have seen that the fact it is in the Operative tree is one of the major issues with using the multifighting in this approach. Many people have suggested that if it were used like that then it should be moved to the awakened tree, something which I completely agree with.

Multi-fighting should go back to how it was supposed to be.

KanoR wrote:

Multi-fighting should go back to how it was supposed to be.

What? Massively buggy?

Vinia wrote:

KanoR wrote:

Multi-fighting should go back to how it was supposed to be.

What? Massively buggy?

you are can reads.

Supposed to be.

In theory, it would of been amazing.

If the company who made the game couldn't sort out the issues with it, do you think that the two-three Dev's we have now can do better?

And yes, I caught the quote button moments after your edit, so what I read and what ended up being quoted was different.

My opinion on what should be done with multifighting is that it is a buff which boosts ALL defenses for say, 30points? or 30%? And maybe 30points to ALL resistances as well for a total of 12 seconds(maybe 14 seconds since combat can lag at times), that should be 3 rounds of combat which gives you 3 rounds of combat to take an advantage with the increased defense and resistance.

In my opinion this gives you a window of opportunity to try and finish your opponent and escape before you're sniped/knifed/hacked and it would all be down to timing as to when you popped the ability.

Yasa i really like that idea.

Vos, i donno if it could be exploited. I just find it very benefitual to pvp. Atm we can only defend against 1 out of 4 trees at any one time.

Say your MA, jump down to mara against 2 gunners and an mkt. With the way i said about the hypers you could possibly make your opponents miss and have a chance to at least kill 1, maybe even 2.

Its to try and stop the gang banging in pvp. Its a 1 v 1 combat system but with greater numbers on 1 side, its a shambles.

My opinion on what should be done with multifighting is that it is a buff which boosts ALL defenses for say, 30points? or 30%? And maybe 30points to ALL resistances as well for a total of 12 seconds(maybe 14 seconds since combat can lag at times), that should be 3 rounds of combat which gives you 3 rounds of combat to take an advantage with the increased defense and resistance.

In my opinion this gives you a window of opportunity to try and finish your opponent and escape before you're sniped/knifed/hacked and it would all be down to timing as to when you popped the ability.

I like this one as an MA i think it would help a bit in group Pvp

Grave

KanoR wrote:

Vinia wrote:

KanoR wrote:

Multi-fighting should go back to how it was supposed to be.

What? Massively buggy?

you are can reads.

Supposed to be.

In theory, it would of been amazing.

If the company who made the game couldn't sort out the issues with it, do you think that the two-three Dev's we have now can do better?

And yes, I caught the quote button moments after your edit, so what I read and what ended up being quoted was different.

Yasamuu wrote:

My opinion on what should be done with multifighting is that it is a buff which boosts ALL defenses for say, 30points? or 30%? And maybe 30points to ALL resistances as well for a total of 12 seconds(maybe 14 seconds since combat can lag at times), that should be 3 rounds of combat which gives you 3 rounds of combat to take an advantage with the increased defense and resistance.

In my opinion this gives you a window of opportunity to try and finish your opponent and escape before you're sniped/knifed/hacked and it would all be down to timing as to when you popped the ability.

Yasa i really like that idea.

Vos, i donno if it could be exploited. I just find it very benefitual to pvp. Atm we can only defend against 1 out of 4 trees at any one time.

Say your MA, jump down to mara against 2 gunners and an mkt. With the way i said about the hypers you could possibly make your opponents miss and have a chance to at least kill 1, maybe even 2.

Its to try and stop the gang banging in pvp. Its a 1 v 1 combat system but with greater numbers on 1 side, its a shambles.

yes i know 100% it can be exploited everying thiing thats ever new has always been exploited and most things old as well

Yeah Yasa is right. Was there exploiting when it was Deflect and any other?

As for 2 v 1, yeah i can and have won. 2 hypers would cut down the 3 or 4 v 1 which tends to happen alot. I'm only thinking of it as * v 1. Imagine the possibiltys of going 3 or 4 head on into 6 or 7 and actually winning due to the team being able to defend better against who is hitting. Clothes do work good but i don't think % match up against the def points of a hyper.

Vosiler wrote:

yes i know 100% it can be exploited everying thiing thats ever new has always been exploited and most things old as well

Are you a dev? No, you're not, so you don't know it can be exploited or not.

there are allways going to be the ones who exploit thats life... If thats what they need to feel good about there said little world thats up to them. But for the rest of us who dont then it might not be a bad thing to bring two Hypers back.

my point is if you can exploit 1 hyper slot and 1 ma gm slot to get 2 of each on then whats going to happen when they put in 2 slots ? 4 hypers stacked ? i my self would love to have 2 hypers but i dont want to go upagainst the people who exploit them and this will only make the exploiting much more powerfull,

theres other things in pvp that arnt balanced ie rolls so lets say ma vs gun the guner has more rolls than the ma before they even put clothes or buffs on

 there is no balance in pvp thats why its pvp and a group is the best way, if you want to 1 vs 1 some one, there IS a duel feature in game

pvp is ment for Group pvp if you could fight 2 vs 1 and win then why would you bother 2 vs 2? and does this mean 5 vs 10? 10 vs 20? 20 sv 40? and so on,

numbers are important in pvp if you dont have them dont get stuck in interlock its comon sence if theres a zerg your not going to kill some one in il best bet is mkt or sniper so it take them a while to get you.

Gerik wrote:

Vosiler wrote:

yes i know 100% it can be exploited everying thiing thats ever new has always been exploited and most things old as well

Are you a dev? No, you're not, so you don't know it can be exploited or not.

yes i am, and everything can be exploited nothing is fool proof and this double hypers HAS been ingame before and it was EXPLOITED then and infact if your a exploiting type you can still have 2 hypers, god stop complaining the skill in pvp is knowing when to switch your hypers ie you see a sniper pop out and go back in sneak, or maybe we should make it so its like poekmon where you have to take it in turns hitting also???

Grave wrote:

there are allways going to be the ones who exploit thats life... If thats what they need to feel good about there said little world thats up to them. But for the rest of us who dont then it might not be a bad thing to bring two Hypers back.

my point is if you can exploit 1 hyper slot and 1 ma gm slot to get 2 of each on then whats going to happen when they put in 2 slots ? 4 hypers stacked ? i my self would love to have 2 hypers but i dont want to go upagainst the people who exploit them and this will only make the exploiting much more powerfull,

By this logic, combat should just be stopped as of now. I love the combat, but I don't want to fight people exploiting it. People will always look to exploit stuff, by either a means of fixing it or to take advantage of it. That doesn't mean the rest of us shouldn't get an improved system.

theres other things in pvp that arnt balanced ie rolls so lets say ma vs gun the guner has more rolls than the ma before they even put clothes or buffs on

Thats because Martial Artists, Naturally are weak against gunman. We all know this. MA has an advantage over hackers. MKT has an advantage over gunman. Hacker has an advantage over MKT's. Each tree has an advantage and disadvantage. Sounds balanced to me.

 there is no balance in pvp thats why its pvp and a group is the best way, if you want to 1 vs 1 some one, there IS a duel feature in game

There has to be some form of balance in pvp. All that is being asked for is something which gives the players in interlock a CHANCE to kill their opponent. I mean, by your logic, if it's a numbers game why even bother with interlock? it becomes pointless, all it does is keep someone inplace and roots work just as well.

pvp is ment for Group pvp if you could fight 2 vs 1 and win then why would you bother 2 vs 2? and does this mean 5 vs 10? 10 vs 20? 20 sv 40? and so on.

Hurrr, again, you can win 2 vs 1. It's not easy, you might not do it 60-80% of the time but you can still win, though as the numbers get bigger it's harder to win as the underdog. IT CAN STILL BE DONE THOUGH. Howitzer Zerging is a tactic that comes to mind (lol tactics in pvp no wai!)

numbers are important in pvp if you dont have them dont get stuck in interlock its comon sence if theres a zerg your not going to kill some one in il best bet is mkt or sniper so it take them a while to get you.

So, an MA should just stop playing the game because he doesn't have the numbers? Doesn't seem like the best message to send out.

Vosiler wrote:

Gerik wrote:

Vosiler wrote:

yes i know 100% it can be exploited everying thiing thats ever new has always been exploited and most things old as well

Are you a dev? No, you're not, so you don't know it can be exploited or not.

yes i am, and everything can be exploited nothing is fool proof and this double hypers HAS been ingame before and it was EXPLOITED then and infact if your a exploiting type you can still have 2 hypers, god stop complaining the skill in pvp is knowing when to switch your hypers ie you see a sniper pop out and go back in sneak, or maybe we should make it so its like poekmon where you have to take it in turns hitting also???

No, you're not. lol So if I use Enhanced Dodge (which has two hyper buffs), I'm exploiting? Where did you get that "stop complaining the skill in pvp is knowing when to switch your hypers"? I don't see anything in my post that has to do with what you just said, you just posted some pile of crap response and then went onto talking about Pokemon. I don't see how that has anything to do with what I said.

Vosiler wrote:

Grave wrote:

there are allways going to be the ones who exploit thats life... If thats what they need to feel good about there said little world thats up to them. But for the rest of us who dont then it might not be a bad thing to bring two Hypers back.

my point is if you can exploit 1 hyper slot and 1 ma gm slot to get 2 of each on then whats going to happen when they put in 2 slots ? 4 hypers stacked ? i my self would love to have 2 hypers but i dont want to go upagainst the people who exploit them and this will only make the exploiting much more powerfull,

By this logic, combat should just be stopped as of now. I love the combat, but I don't want to fight people exploiting it. People will always look to exploit stuff, by either a means of fixing it or to take advantage of it. That doesn't mean the rest of us shouldn't get an improved system.

theres other things in pvp that arnt balanced ie rolls so lets say ma vs gun the guner has more rolls than the ma before they even put clothes or buffs on

Thats because Martial Artists, Naturally are weak against gunman. We all know this. MA has an advantage over hackers. MKT has an advantage over gunman. Hacker has an advantage over MKT's. Each tree has an advantage and disadvantage. Sounds balanced to me.

 there is no balance in pvp thats why its pvp and a group is the best way, if you want to 1 vs 1 some one, there IS a duel feature in game

There has to be some form of balance in pvp. All that is being asked for is something which gives the players in interlock a CHANCE to kill their opponent. I mean, by your logic, if it's a numbers game why even bother with interlock? it becomes pointless, all it does is keep someone inplace and roots work just as well.

pvp is ment for Group pvp if you could fight 2 vs 1 and win then why would you bother 2 vs 2? and does this mean 5 vs 10? 10 vs 20? 20 sv 40? and so on.

Hurrr, again, you can win 2 vs 1. It's not easy, you might not do it 60-80% of the time but you can still win, though as the numbers get bigger it's harder to win as the underdog. IT CAN STILL BE DONE THOUGH. Howitzer Zerging is a tactic that comes to mind (lol tactics in pvp no wai!)

numbers are important in pvp if you dont have them dont get stuck in interlock its comon sence if theres a zerg your not going to kill some one in il best bet is mkt or sniper so it take them a while to get you.

So, an MA should just stop playing the game because he doesn't have the numbers? Doesn't seem like the best message to send out.

Grave wrote:

there are allways going to be the ones who exploit thats life... If thats what they need to feel good about there said little world thats up to them. But for the rest of us who dont then it might not be a bad thing to bring two Hypers back.

my point is if you can exploit 1 hyper slot and 1 ma gm slot to get 2 of each on then whats going to happen when they put in 2 slots ? 4 hypers stacked ? i my self would love to have 2 hypers but i dont want to go upagainst the people who exploit them and this will only make the exploiting much more powerfull,

theres other things in pvp that arnt balanced ie rolls so lets say ma vs gun the guner has more rolls than the ma before they even put clothes or buffs on

 there is no balance in pvp thats why its pvp and a group is the best way, if you want to 1 vs 1 some one, there IS a duel feature in game

pvp is ment for Group pvp if you could fight 2 vs 1 and win then why would you bother 2 vs 2? and does this mean 5 vs 10? 10 vs 20? 20 sv 40? and so on,

numbers are important in pvp if you dont have them dont get stuck in interlock its comon sence if theres a zerg your not going to kill some one in il best bet is mkt or sniper so it take them a while to get you.

Grave wrote:

there are allways going to be the ones who exploit thats life... If thats what they need to feel good about there said little world thats up to them. But for the rest of us who dont then it might not be a bad thing to bring two Hypers back.

my point is if you can exploit 1 hyper slot and 1 ma gm slot to get 2 of each on then whats going to happen when they put in 2 slots ? 4 hypers stacked ? i my self would love to have 2 hypers but i dont want to go upagainst the people who exploit them and this will only make the exploiting much more powerfull,

theres other things in pvp that arnt balanced ie rolls so lets say ma vs gun the guner has more rolls than the ma before they even put clothes or buffs on

there is no balance in pvp thats why its pvp and a group is the best way, if you want to 1 vs 1 some one, there IS a duel feature in game

pvp is ment for Group pvp if you could fight 2 vs 1 and win then why would you bother 2 vs 2? and does this mean 5 vs 10? 10 vs 20? 20 sv 40? and so on,

numbers are important in pvp if you dont have them dont get stuck in interlock its comon sence if theres a zerg your not going to kill some one in il best bet is mkt or sniper so it take them a while to get you.

You don't know that it can be exploited 100% at all. You're speculating that it can. Unless you yourself have physically activated a hyper twice then you're just speculating that it can be done. If it can be done, /bug it but I doubt it can be.

And 2v1's are not impossible to win either.

so if there not impossiable why are people crying about i? i know it can be done and i have proof and buged it, but there will always be exploits dosent matter what you do, there will always be a way to cheat

thats life get over it.



fyi i dont give a toss if i spell correctly and i wont spell check for the sake of anyone reading if you dont like it DONT READ IT

Yasamuu wrote:

You don't know that it can be exploited 100% at all. You're speculating that it can. Unless you yourself have physically activated a hyper twice then you're just speculating that it can be done. If it can be done, /bug it but I doubt it can be.

And 2v1's are not impossible to win either.

so if there not impossiable why are people crying about i? i know it can be done and i have proof and buged it, but there will always be exploits dosent matter what you do, there will always be a way to cheat

thats life get over it.

If I want to kill alot of people, I'll just restat to MKT. I kill about 2-3 times more people that way. But it gets boring, 'cause it's too easy.


In any case: There are only a few unbalances left in PvP imo: Patcher Heal screwup and Throw Defense screwup. Everything else is more or less minor stuff.

Vosiler wrote:

Yasamuu wrote:

You don't know that it can be exploited 100% at all. You're speculating that it can. Unless you yourself have physically activated a hyper twice then you're just speculating that it can be done. If it can be done, /bug it but I doubt it can be.

And 2v1's are not impossible to win either.

so if there not impossiable why are people crying about i? i know it can be done and i have proof and buged it, but there will always be exploits dosent matter what you do, there will always be a way to cheat

thats life get over it.

Uh.

What have I to get over? You're the one complaining about exploiting. Not me.

I think I just stated, there will always be people out to try and exploit but we shouldn't be punished for them wanting to do that.

The point I'm making is that Interlock classes are absolutely pointless in a zerg situation and they need to be able to have a tool to have SOME impact on the PvP.

Vosiler wrote:

Yasamuu wrote:

You don't know that it can be exploited 100% at all. You're speculating that it can. Unless you yourself have physically activated a hyper twice then you're just speculating that it can be done. If it can be done, /bug it but I doubt it can be.

And 2v1's are not impossible to win either.

so if there not impossiable why are people crying about i? i know it can be done and i have proof and buged it, but there will always be exploits dosent matter what you do, there will always be a way to cheat

thats life get over it.

Uh.

What have I to get over? You're the one complaining about exploiting. Not me.

I think I just stated, there will always be people out to try and exploit but we shouldn't be punished for them wanting to do that.

The point I'm making is that Interlock classes are absolutely pointless in a zerg situation and they need to be able to have a tool to have SOME impact on the PvP. There's an ability called multi-fighting sat there, gathering dust. Make it worthwhile and just to point out that this has some actual sense behind the idea, the equivilent ability "sharpshooter" removes the penalty for firing into interlock from outside it. My proposed change would remove some of the restrictions of being an MA in interlock with people firing into interlock at you.