Improving solo playability

"Problem" I have with some of the new stuff is that they're not vey soloable as a lvl 50 and is even annoying when with a group. I would like to have this changed , at least taken into account in next stuff.

Problem cases:

- the GM ninja box in Sati's playground... at lvl 50 the last ninja is level 70 (ranging from 60 to 70). Last night we did such a box with 7 lvl 50's and in the end it became plain annoying.

- Captain Raeder in the SSR quest... also level 70. Normally you can never solo this.

- Elite commando's

I can understand that for some stuff you need to do some grinding, but I think it should still be possible to do all content solo as lvl 50. Also the new stuff feels different qua experience than the old group-based things. E.g. a pandora box 4 end box you can't do on your own, but get 7 lvl 50's together and it doesn't feel like doing a GM ninja box.

Solutions:

- Don't overdo the level on the bosses... do it as in the original constructs ... lvl 60 e.g. as maximum (for a lvl 50) but with a lower drop rate. If you're with many you can do them more quickly, but you can still solo them.

- Allow for more ways to get the "good" gear. E.g. in the SSR Quest you have to have 10 earpieces of the boss to get the SSR glasses... what about uptrading things (as in the pandora boxes). You could do the 10 captain Raeders, or when soloing e.g. you could do 10 lower guys, uptrade those 10 for 1 captain Raeder earpiece, ... This would make a bit more grinding for single lvl 50's but it would be doable solo.

The second option would even be easily implementable I think in the current game without disturbing balance.

Exception on the above are e.g. the 11.3.x missions which are very well playable solo as lvl 50, the hell boots for the merv organization takes some grinding, but it doesn't feel like you need to fight superman for it. This I do like.

The harder something is to get, the more valuable that something is.

GM Ninja box: I did it with 2 50s the other night, was a little slow and ended up timing out at the 68. Triple cliented and did another no problem. Not quite "soloing," but not 7 50s either.

SSR shades: You can easily solo this, with several different methods. If necessary you can dual client and then it goes even quicker.

Elite Commandos: This has to be the easiest. The 55s should be absolutely straightforward. For the 60, load Weapons Boost and Full Auto. Profit.

It's also possible to solo a Pandora Box 4, Sleepwalker Box Stage 3, so on and so forth.

----

Solutions: You need to examine your methods. GM Ninjas have insane resistance/defense to everything but melee. You need a "tank" MA on team, and then supporters who state the ninja for him/her. Wooden Dummy Drill on power/with UGM will do about 130 damage to a level 70, whereas shooting from out of interlock does like 11 damage. It adds up significantly.

Likewise for the other stuff... if you're having problems soloing, I suggest you change the loadout you're using, and if you can't find the one(s) that work, ask around.

No to making things soloable. Everything can be done with 3 or 4 people. Obviously the more the easier. The only one i would like to see would be the melee pills. Its a one time use so i'm not for wanting to pull people out of grinding other things, for something for me.

Most MMOs are about team work. So you know..

Weskie wrote:

Most MMOs are about team work. So you know..

Most MMOs actually have a descent amount of people log on to participate in their content. So you know..

Soloable content needs to be evaluated and put into the game. Statistics show there are many solo MMO players and I can empathize with why. Seriously man take a look around this community or whats left of it after the last few years. I dont even thiink Vector has managed 5 Daimyo boxes total and if it has it's been by the same couple of factions that retain numbers and skilled reliable player bases which in this game is like a needle in a haystack.

Content should be variied something should be offered for everyone at least every few patches. However this MMO is really starting to evolve into a game where the top factions are able to log on ten people tops at once and thats just not going to cut it when your arguing that this MMO should be about teamwork.

privaronT wrote:

Weskie wrote:

Most MMOs are about team work. So you know..

Most MMOs actually have a descent amount of people log on to participate in their content. So you know..

Soloable content needs to be evaluated and put into the game. Statistics show there are many solo MMO players and I can empathize with why. Seriously man take a look around this community or whats left of it after the last few years. I dont even thiink Vector has managed 5 Daimyo boxes total and if it has it's been by the same couple of factions that retain numbers and skilled reliable player bases which in this game is like a needle in a haystack.

Content should be variied something should be offered for everyone at least every few patches. However this MMO is really starting to evolve into a game where the top factions are able to log on ten people tops at once and thats just not going to cut it when your arguing that this MMO should be about teamwork.

Yes, you do have a very good point. I was just saying how *most* MMOs are about team work. Even so, if there isn't all that many players playing MxO at this time.  As for Vector goes, I don't know much about how many players are on there. I only ever log on there once in a blue-moon. But however, from what I've seen from Syntax we have a very good player base, so there's always teams around to help with things. (At the right time zones). Like I said, that's just from Syntax. I don't know about other servers.

Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game

Ballak wrote:

 Failed Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game

I thought that would put it back in perspective. Another fun little analogy for you.

You dont throw a demotivated toddler into the deep end of a swimming pool when they cant even walk.

privaronT wrote:

Ballak wrote:

 Failed Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game

I thought that would put it back in perspective. Another fun little analogy for you.

You dont throw a demotivated toddler into the deep end of a swimming pool when they cant even walk.

Oh let Ballak get his forum cq's.  To your point, I'd be surprised of we have 500 full time subscribers left total.  That's what, 1/200,000th the player base of WoW?

In a perfect world I'd say, team up noob, but that would be on a cruise ship, and were clinging to an inner tube.

So you're saying we shouldn't help each other out, and we should just be able to do everything by ourselves. Okay.

Weskie wrote:

Most MMOs are about team work. So you know..

^ Pretty much says it.

But I do agree on the part about the GM boxes being annoying. Things like that aren't challenging, they're just time consuming.

Ballak wrote:

So you're saying we shouldn't help each other out, and we should just be able to do everything by ourselves. Okay.

Keep going for the forum cq's big guy.  Maybe you can trade them in for a medal or something once the servers shut down for good. 

Seriously the OP is wrong in his premise, but other posters have pointed out maybe we need to start thinking about getting away from heavy team requirement content considering our status as a Massively Hemhorraging Online Role Playing Game.

There is a trick to doing the boxes in Sati's Playground, but I'd probably have to kill you if I told it to you...

My big beef with content is just the opposite of yours, Ogham. Things in my opinion are simply far too easy. A high level NPC is made but all it does is hit hard in/out of interlock, and no change in strategy seems to ever have to be made to take it down. There's plenty of Time-consuming group content, but there's no challenge anywhere.

I'm not going to argue that all those things you have problems with are solo-able because for most people they aren't (The GM box itself is not solo-able by a normal player, though.).

I think Rarebit's getting on the right track with this latest patch. The missions are completley solo-able for a level 50, but then there's Wright as well. A team of people can take her on and get some decent loot and would, if she and her NPCs didn't break so easy and maybe even if she had Runtime going along with all her other override abilities, be a sufficent challenge for those seeking a challenge and yet not be completley necessary to obtaining the content. It's just a little extra thing people can do.

But there's always going to be content that if you want to get you'll have to group up. Once people stop farming it which is usually around the next update or two, you're going to have to either pay people for the items you need if they're available, pay them to help you farm. I don't think just because some players have problems with group content that future group content should be cut down on or made easier for those of us who can get a group to successfully get the content.

The pattern I see forming is the starting content or "bottom-tier" for the update is solo-able. Then as you progress through the content of the "mid-tier" to "high-tier" requires either a sharp player or a small group of players to complete that part. And hopefully what will emerge off of that is a nice challenge for those of us without a challenge but not have it just be some tedious tank of an NPC that you have to slowly wither down over and over. I know Rarebit's tried making challenging things such as the Daimyo box and Wright to give an items that aren't super-awesome stat items but instead have a specific function or look, but again the broken record says "It's time consuming, not a real challenge."

Villemar_MxO wrote:

Ballak wrote:

So you're saying we shouldn't help each other out, and we should just be able to do everything by ourselves. Okay.

Keep going for the forum cq's big guy.  Maybe you can trade them in for a medal or something once the servers shut down for good. 

Seriously the OP is wrong in his premise, but other posters have pointed out maybe we need to start thinking about getting away from heavy team requirement content considering our status as a Massively Hemhorraging Online Role Playing Game.

Oh yes, because getting rid of the teamwork aspect of the game will definitely put us in the right direction for an MMO.

I can only agree with the SSR Captain raeder stuff, he needs to be toned down as it is a "FFA" construct, this shouldnt mean you have to form unlikely alliances with people to get new clothing.

I would also like a challenge, something that would make me say "Wow."

It would need to be something like a high level boss spawning wave after wave of Npcs that constantly swap dodges and resistances dynamically that drop an article of clothing 1 in 30.

Something that requires some strategy.

Ballak wrote:

Villemar_MxO wrote:

Ballak wrote:

So you're saying we shouldn't help each other out, and we should just be able to do everything by ourselves. Okay.

Keep going for the forum cq's big guy.  Maybe you can trade them in for a medal or something once the servers shut down for good. 

Seriously the OP is wrong in his premise, but other posters have pointed out maybe we need to start thinking about getting away from heavy team requirement content considering our status as a Massively Hemhorraging Online Role Playing Game.

Oh yes, because getting rid of the teamwork aspect of the game will definitely put us in the right direction for an MMO.

Please point out exactly where I said "get rid of the teamwork aspect of this game."  I'm guessing you don't do nuance very well?  Context? 

privaronT wrote:

Heres the sad truth dude.. most gamers are dumber than bricks and struggle at the simplist of tasks. Heck they even invented a game system to market that demographic called the Wii.

Harsh. 

Cadsuane wrote:

privaronT wrote:

Heres the sad truth dude.. most gamers are dumber than bricks and struggle at the simplist of tasks. Heck they even invented a game system to market that demographic called the Wii.

Harsh. 

Alas, the truth do hurt sometimes.

I think there needs to be more soloable tasks and now we have the 11. missions.

The game needs a balance of solo and team.

We are getting there, but the team items need to be valuable than solo.

I agree with the need for making some of this content more readily available to players who need to solo. It's not that people want to always solo, but for some timezones it can be far too challenging to find any other players. For example when I was playing last night, I only found 5 other players in my hardline hopping and none were over level 20.

When I first bought this game I was attracted to the fact that most, if not all, of the content back then could be handled solo. Too much of the new high level content is aimed at group work now. That's all well and good if you can find a group. But for those who can't, why deny them that content?

I think it would be helpful if something was done to ease this problem. I'm sure there must be something that could be done, even if it's by way of temporary simulcra or something that are specifically purchased for the task for an example - although it's probably better if I keep any real ideas to my own topic, if I ever come up with something feasible.

Villemar_MxO wrote:

privaronT wrote:

Ballak wrote:

 Failed Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game

I thought that would put it back in perspective. Another fun little analogy for you.

You dont throw a demotivated toddler into the deep end of a swimming pool when they cant even walk.

Oh let Ballak get his forum cq's.  To your point, I'd be surprised of we have 500 full time subscribers left total.  That's what, 1/200,000th the player base of WoW?

In a perfect world I'd say, team up noob, but that would be on a cruise ship, and were clinging to an inner tube.

Only 500?

Nah, surely there are more of us than that!

Nah, surely there are more of us than that!

It may not be that much more. At a stretch I'd say there was around 2000 subscribers, and that's being generous. To futher the point of my first post though, when I was playing at what would be early evening for me, there was a grand total of 7 players, including myself, in the Matrix proper (not counting the archives or constructs) on the Syntax server -- and that's supposed to be the busiest server.

That's just enough people to get one mission team going and to allow one person to AFK dance at the hardline of their choice. =/

we all know the tricks, doesn't make em soloable tho. Not that I need em to be. I think when new content - that is worth it comes on, people get there in great numbers and help each other out. Maybe if you don't have many friends, well...yeah. But basically this is MMO policy, team work. That's why it takes more than a team to kill Wright.

*edited* Not worth my time

Chuui wrote:

Nah, surely there are more of us than that!

It may not be that much more. At a stretch I'd say there was around 2000 subscribers, and that's being generous. To futher the point of my first post though, when I was playing at what would be early evening for me, there was a grand total of 7 players, including myself, in the Matrix proper (not counting the archives or constructs) on the Syntax server -- and that's supposed to be the busiest server.

That's just enough people to get one mission team going and to allow one person to AFK dance at the hardline of their choice. =/

All I know is, the Natives are Restless.  By chance, me and another member of my faction both have the same subscription cycle, and both of us are going on a 4-week on/2-week off cycle times with the patches.  My subby expires today, and I'll be back Dec. 11th (which is when I'm guessing the next patch is).  There's nothing to do these days.  Although, while it was kinda cool to get caught up on stuff, I can't justify the price.   And, I did bring my lvl 25 Mech alt to 30 this patch in order to access 1/3rd of the content that I priviously had access, it was a completely joyless chore.  So I can't sit and powergrind for long sustained periods of time.

Getting back on topic, Recursion is barren, Vector isn't much better.  Syntax is the only server I see that ever gets to medium.  (Actually Vector hit medium twice, a week ago, on the afternoons on Saturday & Sunday; but that was because of a priviously planned tournament).

In a perfect world?  Yeah teamwork all the way.  But the population is so low (at least on 2 out of the 3 servers) that that needs to be taken into consideration.  I think the merge idea is good to look at as a temporary fix.  And yeah I might have lowballed the number back a while ago upthread, but I'd say at best 700-800.  And since the Winter Holiday is anamalous with ppl coming back on break etc., after that expect to see a huge drop.  And the economy is still quite bad, many of us have to be more strict about our entertainment dollar.  Hence my 4 week on / 2 week off new MxO schedule.

so much in this game is solo playable alrdy, adding more just doesnt make any sence. and the high levels are needed for those of us that are actually good enough to solo them... we need a challenge 

Chuui wrote:

I agree with the need for making some of this content more readily available to players who need to solo. It's not that people want to always solo, but for some timezones it can be far too challenging to find any other players. For example when I was playing last night, I only found 5 other players in my hardline hopping and none were over level 20.

When I first bought this game I was attracted to the fact that most, if not all, of the content back then could be handled solo. Too much of the new high level content is aimed at group work now. That's all well and good if you can find a group. But for those who can't, why deny them that content?

I think it would be helpful if something was done to ease this problem. I'm sure there must be something that could be done, even if it's by way of temporary simulcra or something that are specifically purchased for the task for an example - although it's probably better if I keep any real ideas to my own topic, if I ever come up with something feasible.

Chuui hit the nail on the head here. As it is, I don't have the time commitment for MxO as much as I used to in 2005. I'm busy with college and martial arts training, something I'm not willing to give up. As it is, this game is gearing more towards the unemployed or school students than it used to be. Hell, I barely have any friends online just because they have a personal life to attend to (pretty much every U.S.-based players in my faction.). The only thing that keeps me subscribing to this game are the critical missions since my chances of attending Live Events have been nill since last Spring, and with the recent format, I feel partially screwed on soloing missions when it comes to dealing with multiple level 51 NPCs at the same time, and god-forbid the scripted level 55 Agent.

The main problem with this current format not every single player has connections, nor knows when each server has a "hot jack-in timeslot" because pretty much 90% of us are either in school, college, or have a job. Real life comes first for everyone, and I barely have enough time for this game as it is. Right now, I'm jaded enough to cancel my subscription two months from now if this system stays in place permanently. I've been around since the end of Nightfall, and this game is not solo-friendly anymore (don't say "Use facebook/Myspace/etc.". I only see ten lvl 50 Zion/EPN players max on my buddy list if I'm lucky enough, and only have three active faction members whenever I log in, which means my chances of enjoying the content are pretty much nill).