The Problem With Hyper-Jump

A lot of people complain about Hyper-jumping in PvP. Honestly, it's not that big of a deal. As everybody knows, there's two things you can do with hyper-jump. Selecting the ability, point-click-jump. In PvP, this is rarely used.

Why? As many of us know, it's precision HJ-ing. You usually go straight forward as well as moving rather slowly, and to watch the camera scroll up a building you want to HJ on leaves you vulnerable for precious seconds you need in PvP. The other technique is simply by pressing Cntrl+Space, which sends you directly up, arching, and landing as far as you hold the two keys down for as well as staying in the max range of your super jump ability.

Why is it that those who Cntrl+Space seemingly always get away? Well in PvP, you generally try to estimate where a person will land. People can jump straight up, or they can do a full jump, or land half-way, etc. The problem ultimately is, is when you go so high up you leave the range of your enemy, so the person waiting on the ground who has you targeted will most of the time, lose his target. Sometimes you'll get lucky, and all you have to do is look up to see where your target is going to land, generally it's easiest to see if your target just went straight up, because obviously he'll come down the same way. Unfortunately, when someone does the entire/half Cntrl+Space jump, you lose the target, i.e. disappearing off your client. The fact that you can do this at pretty much anytime except in IL (hyper-speed/seraphims usually keeps up with a majority of the speed debuffs) it's something that's very hard to counter(nearly every root in the game has a cast timer or is broken by damage *might be all*). Although it's really satisfying when you bust the guy's shield as he HJ's and then lands right where you thought he would, and then destroy him in IL, I just wanted to know if there was any way you could either lower the height at which you can HJ, as well as keeping the same distance you get from doing a Cntrl+Space jump, or any other idea someone could come up with that could be applicable to the game.

----

Okay, because every single person I've seen in this thread basically didn't see what I was getting at, and has degenerated into "LOL LETS TALK ABOUT HEALS, OR MKT, OR ABOUT HOW MUCH ZION JUMPS, AND HE CANT GET CQ, QQ" I drew a picture for all of you. This has nothing to do with anything else other than Hyper Jump/Beta Jump (give or take 20-60 Super Jump pts.)

#1 - The Stickman to the bottom left is where someone is standing before they Hyper-jump.

#2 - The Stickman to the very top is someone who has reached the peak of their Cntrl+Space jump.

#3 - The Stick man at the lower bottom is someone who has performed a Precision Hyper-Jump.

#4 - The Red Line indicates where you will lose your target due to being out of range on your client (only achievable via Cntrl+Space/Precision only when you're trying to go up a tall building)

#5 - The Green dotted line indicates where my proposed cntrl+space would be, where you would achieve greater height than a precision, yet still keep the same distance. You won't get as much air time as the old cntrl+space, but you will stay in range of someone's client who is trying to keep up with you.

#6 - The little messy line hayball at the end of these lines is where obviously you'd land.

There's only two solutions I can think of. You raise the red line up, or you lower the cntrl+space to the green curve.

i.e. Anyone who is actively chasing someone HJing, will most likely be under the HJer, so distance horizontal wide wouldn't really matter.

Now the only *problem* I see with this for those who try to HJ up tall buildings. But usually, excluding the DT buildings, as long as you can scroll up high enough, you have no problem scaling those buildings because the height at which you scroll is your only limit on how high you can jump, i.e. once you scale the building with your camera, you can still jump forward as much as you would if it was level ground.

I honestly don't think it's a nerf, in my opinion.

Great idea..!!

And while we are at it we should also have special powers granted for the mech gankers so they can really do som harm. Preffered it be something not already available as a xploit of course.

There is really is alot of whining about this whole HJ'ing away from pvp thing.
Fact is that HJ is a skills just as any other..we all have it and we can all use it whenever we chose to. And as far as im concerned there are NO official rules on PvP, basically anything goes, unless you sploit that is.
So if your one of those that claims to never run/jump from fight..well good for you...you deserve nothing less than a medal and paper hat then. Allthoug i doubt that anyone can claim not to be guilty of the hideous crime HJ'ing out of a fight really is.

Besides, most players use HJ only as a last resort to get away from great numbers and I see nothing wrong in that. Granted there are those who use HJ everytime they get the chance but so what? Get someone else to kill then and stop crying about it.
Players have different views about what is fun to them..if someone thinks its fun to annoy gankers by HJ'ing away from a fight, then let him/her! Who cares??
HJ in pvp is just not a problem, its just part of the game, so live with it.

If anyting, there should be done alot more about sploiters. They ruin the game more than anything else.

But hey...ultimately its still only a game right.

Great idea..!!

And while we are at it we should also have special powers granted for the mech gankers so they can really do som harm. Preffered it be something not already available as a xploit of course.

There is really is alot of whining about this whole HJ'ing away from pvp thing.
Fact is that HJ is a skills just as any other..we all have it and we can all use it whenever we chose to. And as far as im concerned there are NO official rules on PvP, basically anything goes, unless you sploit that is.
So if your one of those that claims to never run/jump from fight..well good for you...you deserve nothing less than a medal and paper hat then. Allthoug i doubt that anyone can claim not to be guilty of the hideous crime HJ'ing out of a fight really is.

Besides, most players use HJ only as a last resort to get away from great numbers and I see nothing wrong in that. Granted there are those who use HJ everytime they get the chance but so what? Get someone else to kill then and stop crying about it.
Players have different views about what is fun to them..if someone thinks its fun to annoy gankers by HJ'ing away from a fight, then let him/her! Who cares??
HJ in pvp is just not a problem, its just part of the game, so live with it.

If anyting, there should be done alot more about sploiters. They ruin the game more than anything else.

But hey...ultimately its still only a game right.

I always wished that HJ had a higher disadvantage when in combat mode (you know when you have that icon under your HP bar when you are being or are attacking, cant think right now lol)
anyway...
So when in combat mode Things like:

• cost x3 IS to HJ, so constant HJ'in would come to an end
• or a casting timer to HJ, so when landing couldn't just take of as fast
• Reduce in HJ distance
• A clear trail of where they have gone appearing, like the tissue effect we seen
• Not be able to use CRTL+Space, only by selecting the ability and selecting landing location
• Oh... and /face needs to come back, don't flag up if you cant deal with it

These are just a few examples some unfair some people may like but there just example

ArchangeI wrote:

Great idea..!!

And while we are at it we should also have special powers granted for the mech gankers so they can really do som harm. Preffered it be something not already available as a xploit of course.

There is really is alot of whining about this whole HJ'ing away from pvp thing.
Fact is that HJ is a skills just as any other..we all have it and we can all use it whenever we chose to. And as far as im concerned there are NO official rules on PvP, basically anything goes, unless you sploit that is.
So if your one of those that claims to never run/jump from fight..well good for you...you deserve nothing less than a medal and paper hat then. Allthoug i doubt that anyone can claim not to be guilty of the hideous crime HJ'ing out of a fight really is.

Besides, most players use HJ only as a last resort to get away from great numbers and I see nothing wrong in that. Granted there are those who use HJ everytime they get the chance but so what? Get someone else to kill then and stop crying about it.
Players have different views about what is fun to them..if someone thinks its fun to annoy gankers by HJ'ing away from a fight, then let him/her! Who cares??
HJ in pvp is just not a problem, its just part of the game, so live with it.

If anyting, there should be done alot more about sploiters. They ruin the game more than anything else.

But hey...ultimately its still only a game right.

I think you're entirely missing the point.  I'll elaborate when I'm awake

I doubt it!
Guess we have different points of view if anything. But thats hardly missing the point
But do elaborate anyway!

• Oh.. and /face needs to come back, don't flag up if you cant deal with it

I agree..if you cant deal with ppl using HJ dont flag!

Oh I guess thats not what you meant!

Another point of view, would be to remove healing in PvP that it can be atleast annoying as HJ. HJ is from the original Matrix movie and shouldn't be removed or changed. Looking at the PvP overall I really think we need more focus on the *CENSORED* CQ points so they have a point of being in this game. Also could be good to add some more options in the PvP to the organizations we have talked so much about.

Another point of view, would be to remove healing in PvP that it can be atleast annoying as HJ. HJ is from the original Matrix movie and shouldn't be removed or changed. Looking at the PvP overall I really think we need more focus on the *CENSORED* CQ points so they have a point of being in this game. Also could be good to add some more options in the PvP to the organizations we have talked so much about.

Well I can't recall Snipers, Sneak, Punts, hacking in combat, buffing etc... from the movie, should they get removed too? I think Rarebit said if he had his way MxO would be MA and Guns.

As for HJ, I like the idea of a reduction superjump points while in combat mode, so it can still be used (if the player wants to) but it won't be (imo) the getaway button it is right now, but more tactical. This also means that people would have to run and wait for the combat mode to go to be able to perform a full HJ, giving opponants the opportunity to give chase for a time. 

What I got from the movie is that a HJ takes some concentration to do, as it does with most rule-bending, when getting fired upon or attacked a person would not fully concentrate on the jump.

Mindsweep wrote:

Another point of view, would be to remove healing in PvP that it can be atleast annoying as HJ. HJ is from the original Matrix movie and shouldn't be removed or changed. Looking at the PvP overall I really think we need more focus on the *CENSORED* CQ points so they have a point of being in this game. Also could be good to add some more options in the PvP to the organizations we have talked so much about.

Well I can't recall Snipers, Sneak, Punts, hacking in combat, buffing etc... from the movie, should they get removed too? I think Rarebit said if he had his way MxO would be MA and Guns.

I never said that I wanted to remove anything, just making the point, that if HJ is annoying then healing is annoying to in PvP. Overall it's the PvP combat system that should be looked at.

Mindsweep wrote:

Another point of view, would be to remove healing in PvP that it can be atleast annoying as HJ. HJ is from the original Matrix movie and shouldn't be removed or changed. Looking at the PvP overall I really think we need more focus on the *CENSORED* CQ points so they have a point of being in this game. Also could be good to add some more options in the PvP to the organizations we have talked so much about.

Well I can't recall Snipers, Sneak, Punts, hacking in combat, buffing etc... from the movie, should they get removed too? I think Rarebit said if he had his way MxO would be MA and Guns.

As for HJ, I like the idea of a reduction superjump points while in combat mode, so it can still be used (if the player wants to) but it won't be (imo) the getaway button it is right now, but more tactical. This also means that people would have to run and wait for the combat mode to go to be able to perform a full HJ, giving opponants the opportunity to give chase for a time. 

What I got from the movie is that a HJ takes some concentration to do, as it does with most rule-bending, when getting fired upon or attacked a person would not fully concentrate on the jump.

The issue is balance at the end of the day.  PvP in MxO is NOT balanced, and because of the chaotic nature of it (mainly numbers of participants on opposing sides/tactics/tricks/exploits) it never will be no matter how much work they put into it.

HJ this, heals that, nerf this, boost that, misc et al.

I read the same arguments again and again, anybody else getting the feeling of deja vu here?

You are aware there is such thing as PvE right? Doing this would make Westview even harder for lowbies, and as an added bonus it could also make it impossible for Zionists to get away from the lvl 100 agent spawns cause they can't jump far enough after they were shot.

The issue is balance at the end of the day.  PvP in MxO is NOT balanced, and because of the chaotic nature of it (mainly numbers of participants on opposing sides/tactics/tricks/exploits) it never will be no matter how much work they put into it.

HJ this, heals that, nerf this, boost that, misc et al.

I read the same arguments again and again, anybody else getting the feeling of deja vu here?

Dripping-Cheese wrote:

The issue is balance at the end of the day.  PvP in MxO is NOT balanced, and because of the chaotic nature of it (mainly numbers of participants on opposing sides/tactics/tricks/exploits) it never will be no matter how much work they put into it.

HJ this, heals that, nerf this, boost that, misc et al.

I read the same arguments again and again, anybody else getting the feeling of deja vu here?

Yep, and in the end these threads are pointless...

I think HJ is fine as it is, there are roots and other Speed Debuffs that will hold them down and if you dont use them, that CQ is going to jump into the sun but it doesn't matter as you cant win every fight.

If they are running away, they cant fight back, so force them to run then go after someone else.

EDIT: MAs could do with an ability to root/speed debuff someone, make it break on damage and I think it will be fine.

Great idea..!!

And while we are at it we should also have special powers granted for the mech gankers so they can really do som harm. Preffered it be something not already available as a xploit of course.

There is really is alot of whining about this whole HJ'ing away from pvp thing.
Fact is that HJ is a skills just as any other..we all have it and we can all use it whenever we chose to. And as far as im concerned there are NO official rules on PvP, basically anything goes, unless you sploit that is.
So if your one of those that claims to never run/jump from fight..well good for you...you deserve nothing less than a medal and paper hat then. Allthoug i doubt that anyone can claim not to be guilty of the hideous crime HJ'ing out of a fight really is.

Besides, most players use HJ only as a last resort to get away from great numbers and I see nothing wrong in that. Granted there are those who use HJ everytime they get the chance but so what? Get someone else to kill then and stop crying about it.
Players have different views about what is fun to them..if someone thinks its fun to annoy gankers by HJ'ing away from a fight, then let him/her! Who cares??
HJ in pvp is just not a problem, its just part of the game, so live with it.

If anyting, there should be done alot more about sploiters. They ruin the game more than anything else.

But hey...ultimately its still only a game right.

Oh. dear.

You've used a perfectly cogent post to claim that 'mechs' are 'gankers' and 'exploiters'.  Well done, Timmy, that's a fantastic finger painting.

As divers in football are now punished, so should these incessant claims of exploits.  I, for one am sick of being told I'm cheating because my opposition can't mount an organized attack.  It's old, you sound ridiculous, and you really should have learned by now. 

It's amazing how some Zionists (yes I'm actually calling out a small pocket of Zionists out on this - the Merv's have some integrity) can have momentary numbers and be perfectly happy to obliterate anything that moves.  Yet, when a team's worth of Machines show up, it's all about the 'mech' gankers and their exploits.

Do you people listen to yourselves?  You make my brain drip out of my ears.  Oh, and you did completely miss the point.

Apologies, Ballak.  Sometimes the exasperation is such that venting is required to clear some room to fit in my vast and varied knowledge of exploits.  I agree with your original post in principle, I just don't see maintaining your intended target when they HJ will give any real benefit.  If they're that determined to get away then they will.  If you're that determined to catch them then chances are you will.  If not, then oh well - MORUL VIKTAREE.

I'd like to say that earlier today/yesterday there was some rather good PvP with each side relatively equal in numbers and nary a jumper to be seen.  Good game Zion, I hope the trend continues ^_^

I agreed, it was really funny, Gf everyone.

/Ctrl+space

ArchangeI wrote:

Great idea..!!

And while we are at it we should also have special powers granted for the mech gankers so they can really do som harm. Preffered it be something not already available as a xploit of course.

There is really is alot of whining about this whole HJ'ing away from pvp thing.
Fact is that HJ is a skills just as any other..we all have it and we can all use it whenever we chose to. And as far as im concerned there are NO official rules on PvP, basically anything goes, unless you sploit that is.
So if your one of those that claims to never run/jump from fight..well good for you...you deserve nothing less than a medal and paper hat then. Allthoug i doubt that anyone can claim not to be guilty of the hideous crime HJ'ing out of a fight really is.

Besides, most players use HJ only as a last resort to get away from great numbers and I see nothing wrong in that. Granted there are those who use HJ everytime they get the chance but so what? Get someone else to kill then and stop crying about it.
Players have different views about what is fun to them..if someone thinks its fun to annoy gankers by HJ'ing away from a fight, then let him/her! Who cares??
HJ in pvp is just not a problem, its just part of the game, so live with it.

If anyting, there should be done alot more about sploiters. They ruin the game more than anything else.

But hey...ultimately its still only a game right.

Oh. dear.

You've used a perfectly cogent post to claim that 'mechs' are 'gankers' and 'exploiters'.  Well done, Timmy, that's a fantastic finger painting.

As divers in football are now punished, so should these incessant claims of exploits.  I, for one am sick of being told I'm cheating because my opposition can't mount an organized attack.  It's old, you sound ridiculous, and you really should have learned by now. 

It's amazing how some Zionists (yes I'm actually calling out a small pocket of Zionists out on this - the Merv's have some integrity) can have momentary numbers and be perfectly happy to obliterate anything that moves.  Yet, when a team's worth of Machines show up, it's all about the 'mech' gankers and their exploits.

Do you people listen to yourselves?  You make my brain drip out of my ears.  Oh, and you did completely miss the point.

Apologies, Ballak.  Sometimes the exasperation is such that venting is required to clear some room to fit in my vast and varied knowledge of exploits.  I agree with your original post in principle, I just don't see maintaining your intended target when they HJ will give any real benefit.  If they're that determined to get away then they will.  If you're that determined to catch them then chances are you will.  If not, then oh well - MORUL VIKTAREE.

Well said..you really got me there! Wow..got thing you saw this post and put me in my place!

You should seek out a doctor with that brain dripping you got going on there mate!

You've used a perfectly cogent post to claim that 'mechs' are 'gankers' and 'exploiters'.  Well done, Timmy, that's a fantastic finger painting.

As divers in football are now punished, so should these incessant claims of exploits.  I, for one am sick of being told I'm cheating because my opposition can't mount an organized attack.  It's old, you sound ridiculous, and you really should have learned by now. 

It's amazing how some Zionists (yes I'm actually calling out a small pocket of Zionists out on this - the Merv's have some integrity) can have momentary numbers and be perfectly happy to obliterate anything that moves.  Yet, when a team's worth of Machines show up, it's all about the 'mech' gankers and their exploits.

just the play the game as it is and be happy with that!

Well said..you really got me there! Wow..got thing you saw this post and put me in my place!

You should seek out a doctor with that brain dripping you got going on there mate!

Another point of view, would be to remove healing in PvP that it can be atleast annoying as HJ. HJ is from the original Matrix movie and shouldn't be removed or changed. Looking at the PvP overall I really think we need more focus on the *CENSORED* CQ points so they have a point of being in this game. Also could be good to add some more options in the PvP to the organizations we have talked so much about.

Mindsweep wrote:

Another point of view, would be to remove healing in PvP that it can be atleast annoying as HJ. HJ is from the original Matrix movie and shouldn't be removed or changed. Looking at the PvP overall I really think we need more focus on the *CENSORED* CQ points so they have a point of being in this game. Also could be good to add some more options in the PvP to the organizations we have talked so much about.

The difference between hyperjump and healing is that healing is a part of every other MMO system ever created. Hyperjump should not be removed. However, something should be done to discourage the entire Snipe/Wheeee! mentality. A longer lasting trail, and a way for you to not lose your target when he reaches the apex of his jump seem like two very easy and necessary fixes so that people who at least want to chase the jumper down have some means of doing so.


Oh, and MA's don't need a root. They need a fast cast slow and a guaranteed enrage move that doesn't require a state.

Using healing was just an example btw. could have been ability like Master Shadow. So the problem is not the hyper jump itself, but the players who are snipers and there mentality? If there should be done something about the hyper jump (all because is annoying in PvP) I would rather see some changes in the whole PvP combat system so it's not only based on that you are in another organization. Factions Vs. Factions, Teams Vs, Teams and the list is long. Hyper jump is just for me a smaller problem.

Great idea..!!

And while we are at it we should also have special powers granted for the mech gankers so they can really do som harm. Preffered it be something not already available as a xploit of course.

So the "mech gankers" are the only people that would benefit from this then (Ignoring the whole mech ganker comment at this point as that's a whole 'nother issue)?  Your argument is that we shouldn't nerf HJ because you can't escape death from a mob of enemies.  Well...see that would actually make sense to die when the numbers are against you.

There is really is a_lot of whining about this whole HJ'ing away from pvp thing.
Fact is that HJ is a skills just as any other..we all have it and we can all use it whenever we choose to. And As far as I'm concerned there are NO official rules on PvP, basically anything goes, unless you exploit that is.
So if your one of those that claims to never run/jump from fight..well good for you...you deserve nothing less than a medal and paper hat then. Allthough i doubt that anyone can claim not to be guilty of the hideous crime HJ'ing out of a fight really is.

This is not a thread complaining that everyone else hyper jumps except him and his buddies.  It is a well-constructed thought to counter the fact that Hyper Jump is arguably a little unbalanced, once a person hyper jumps there is basically nothing you can do to stop them.  While you might say the cq isn't that important, what if they have a luggable you could really use?  Besides his suggestion isn't necessarily nerfing hyper-jump so much as suggesting the height of the hyper-jump be made smaller so the opponent doesn't lose their target making it so they can proceed to track them down.  While I myself am not sure about changing hyper jump at all this seems like a very reasonable idea.

Besides, most players use HJ only as a last resort to get away from great numbers and I see nothing wrong in that. Granted there are those who use HJ every_time they get the chance but so what? Get someone else to kill then and stop crying about it.
Players have different views about what is fun to them..if someone thinks its fun to annoy gankers by HJ'ing away from a fight, then let him/her! Who cares??
HJ in pvp is just not a problem (opinion), its just part of the game, so live with it.

If anything, there should be done a_lot more done about exsploiters. They ruin the game more than anything else.

While I am wary of defending people who use exploits to their advantage, how are they ruining the game any more than obsessive HJ'ers (Keep in mind the HJ'ers personally don't bother me much)?  The exploits possible these days are very few and do not make that much of a difference when it comes to pvp.  Not only that but VERY few people even bother to use them. 

But hey...ultimately its still only a game right.

exsuscito wrote:

You've used a perfectly cogent post to claim that 'mechs' are 'gankers' and 'exploiters'.  Well done, Timmy, that's a fantastic finger painting.

As divers in football are now punished, so should these incessant claims of exploits.  I, for one am sick of being told I'm cheating because my opposition can't mount an organized attack.  It's old, you sound ridiculous, and you really should have learned by now. 

It's amazing how some Zionists (yes I'm actually calling out a small pocket of Zionists out on this - the Merv's have some integrity) can have momentary numbers and be perfectly happy to obliterate anything that moves.  Yet, when a team's worth of Machines show up, it's all about the 'mech' gankers and their exploits.

Agreed.

But it's perfectly ok to Stereotype Zionists as whining children who suck at the game, HJ all the time and complain whenever they get beaten?

Vinia wrote:

exsuscito wrote:

You've used a perfectly cogent post to claim that 'mechs' are 'gankers' and 'exploiters'.  Well done, Timmy, that's a fantastic finger painting.

As divers in football are now punished, so should these incessant claims of exploits.  I, for one am sick of being told I'm cheating because my opposition can't mount an organized attack.  It's old, you sound ridiculous, and you really should have learned by now. 

It's amazing how some Zionists (yes I'm actually calling out a small pocket of Zionists out on this - the Merv's have some integrity) can have momentary numbers and be perfectly happy to obliterate anything that moves.  Yet, when a team's worth of Machines show up, it's all about the 'mech' gankers and their exploits.

Agreed.

But it's perfectly ok to Stereotype Zionists as whining children who suck at the game, HJ all the time and complain whenever they get beaten? It cracks me up whenever I see someone posting "The PvP was great, Zion didn't jump" it's so patronizing and yet hilarious at the same time cause the player earnestly felt they were doing us Zionists a favour by paying us that "Comment".

Hypocrites are awesome

Vinia wrote:

exsuscito wrote:

You've used a perfectly cogent post to claim that 'mechs' are 'gankers' and 'exploiters'.  Well done, Timmy, that's a fantastic finger painting.

As divers in football are now punished, so should these incessant claims of exploits.  I, for one am sick of being told I'm cheating because my opposition can't mount an organized attack.  It's old, you sound ridiculous, and you really should have learned by now. 

It's amazing how some Zionists (yes I'm actually calling out a small pocket of Zionists out on this - the Merv's have some integrity) can have momentary numbers and be perfectly happy to obliterate anything that moves.  Yet, when a team's worth of Machines show up, it's all about the 'mech' gankers and their exploits.

Agreed.

But it's perfectly ok to Stereotype Zionists as whining children who suck at the game, HJ all the time and complain whenever they get beaten? It cracks me up whenever I see someone posting "The PvP was great, Zion didn't jump" it's so patronizing and yet hilarious at the same time cause the player earnestly felt they were doing us Zionists a favour by paying us that "Comment".

Hypocrites are awesome

Your post doesn't make sense with reference to mine.  It's like you quoted the wrong one by mistake.

Ridiculous but necessary disclaimer: No I'm not employing passive aggression, it should read exactly how it sounds.  No sarcasm or malice. 

Ex's post wasn't directed just towards Zion except the last comment which is more indicative of the last couple days of pvp.  I can actually testify to a lot of that as the last 2 days have started with Zion having the numbers then somehow disappearing later on in the day as more Machinists showed up.  In the end it was just Machinists  fighting against a small group of mervs...Not only that but a select few did take it upon themselves to try and call myself and a few others on my team out for exploiting.

Either way when people post said "comment" it is meant as a joke, no one thinks their doing you a "favor" by paying you that comment.

Tenshi wrote:

Ex's post wasn't directed just towards Zion except the last comment which is more indicative of the last couple days of pvp.  I can actually testify to a lot of that as the last 2 days have started with Zion having the numbers then somehow disappearing later on in the day as more Machinists showed up.  In the end it was just Machinists  fighting against a small group of mervs...Not only that but a select few did take it upon themselves to try and call myself and a few others on my team out for exploiting.

Either way when people post said "comment" it is meant as a joke, no one thinks their doing you a "favor" by paying you that comment.

I saw that... and raised an eyebrow. For at least an hour I pvp'ed against 5-6 Zionites (read on, before you think this is aimed at ALL zions... as it's not), who not only all of a sudden found a bit of attitude in them with having numbers around them (the loudest refusing to duel at all, yet keep trying to bait me to flag again).

Fine... when winning we all get a little confident. And to be fair only one of the 5-6 was actually being a pain.

But throughout this 1v5-6 they were healing. Once again... fine... I was flagging out of choice. But then the machines rolled in with more numbers, began to heal, and 2 of the original 5-6 that I was fighting started to complain that healing was ruining the fight.

It's a small few that give Zion's a bad name in pvp, yet as always it's those few that are the loudest...

Back on topic, the suggestion of a longer trail and not losing the target would be ideal, and not really impact the rest of the game when using HJ.

Perhaps if while in combat you didn't jump as far as when you were not in combat? A scaling debuff for super jump dependent on your level while in combat.

Because I doubt you'd be able to do a hyper jump as easily in a combat situation than if you weren't and were just getting from point A to point B.

Perhaps if while in combat you didn't jump as far as when you were not in combat? A scaling debuff for super jump dependent on your level while in combat.

Because I doubt you'd be able to do a hyper jump as easily in a combat situation than if you weren't and were just getting from point A to point B.

Zudrag wrote:

Perhaps if while in combat you didn't jump as far as when you were not in combat? A scaling debuff for super jump dependent on your level while in combat.

Because I doubt you'd be able to do a hyper jump as easily in a combat situation than if you weren't and were just getting from point A to point B.

I said almost exactly the same thing earlier but Pylat complained that it would make Westview harder for lowbies and make avoiding lvl 100 Agents harder....

Vinia wrote:

Zudrag wrote:

Perhaps if while in combat you didn't jump as far as when you were not in combat? A scaling debuff for super jump dependent on your level while in combat.

Because I doubt you'd be able to do a hyper jump as easily in a combat situation than if you weren't and were just getting from point A to point B.

I said almost exactly the same thing earlier but Pylat complained that it would make Westview harder for lowbies and make avoiding lvl 100 Agents harder....

Oh that whole arguement.

Please. You'd still be able to hyper jump, just not as far. And if you die, whoop-dee-do. Recon and carry on.

Precisely, but I wasn't going to drag this argument debate's thread down the road of the lvl 100 Agents, we already have a looooong thread on that...

Rightly so if these changes make it harder for us to escape those annoying things, as soon as they spawn they put you in the combat state.  And the main reason low levels jump in Westview (seeing as they are forced there at a certain level) is to avoid the NPCs attacking them (meaning they are in the combat state).

The game isn't just made for players with experiance, it is also designed for people who are literally new, and 'nerfing' a big part of the movies isn't the smartest way to go.

And seeing as everyone likes to play the Role Playing card to defend the game, surely when running away from people trying to kill you, you'd jump further and faster, even the Agents had trouble keeping up with Trinity.

[[Ok, I'm not one to <3 hyperjumping...especially when those bloody snipers do it....oh, makes my blood boil on overload, but shortening the HJ height or giving it more penalties, I hate to say it, sounds ridiculous. I mean, what about for RP? HyperJUmp is defying the rules of gravity...not just defying the rules of gravity, a tiny bit. You're suppose to go sky high, especially when you spend the money to get it leveled...and, what about LEs? Sometimes you need to HJ to keep up, or catch a view of things before traveling the highest point where you can't see...I say leave Hyperjump the way it is, and let the giant pansies who do hyperjump, do it, and then when they land, pwn them until their PC explodes

^_^

-DDH]]

Precisely, but I wasn't going to drag this argument debate's thread down the road of the lvl 100 Agents, we already have a looooong thread on that...

Okay, because every single person I've seen in this thread basically didn't see what I was getting at, and has degenerated into "LOL LETS TALK ABOUT HEALS, OR MKT, OR ABOUT HOW MUCH ZION JUMPS, AND HE CANT GET CQ, QQ" I drew a picture for all of you. This has nothing to do with anything else other than Hyper Jump/Beta Jump (give or take 20-60 Super Jump pts.)

#1 - The Stickman to the bottom left is where someone is standing before they Hyper-jump.

#2 - The Stickman to the very top is someone who has reached the peak of their Cntrl+Space jump.

#3 - The Stick man at the lower bottom is someone who has performed a Precision Hyper-Jump.

#4 - The Red Line indicates where you will lose your target due to being out of range on your client (only achievable via Cntrl+Space/Precision only when you're trying to go up a tall building)

#5 - The Green dotted line indicates where my proposed cntrl+space would be, where you would achieve greater height than a precision, yet still keep the same distance. You won't get as much air time as the old cntrl+space, but you will stay in range of someone's client who is trying to keep up with you.

#6 - The little messy line hayball at the end of these lines is where obviously you'd land.

There's only two solutions I can think of. You raise the red line up, or you lower the cntrl+space to the green curve.

i.e. Anyone who is actively chasing someone HJing, will most likely be under the HJer, so distance horizontal wide wouldn't really matter.

Now the only *problem* I see with this for those who try to HJ up tall buildings. But usually, excluding the DT buildings, as long as you can scroll up high enough, you have no problem scaling those buildings because the height at which you scroll is your only limit on how high you can jump, i.e. once you scale the building with your camera, you can still jump forward as much as you would if it was level ground.

I honestly don't think it's a nerf, in my opinion.

Also, this whole "omg teh lowbies, how will they survive with this oh so nerfed Hyper-jump"

Hyper-jump is pretty nerfed to begin with, considering at a certain level it's pointless to level it up anymore. And when an NPC does an ability on you, you *WILL* get hit, no matter how far away you are unless they miss, so fyi, HJ really doesn't even help you with Avoidance in PvE, it's just so you take that hit and get as far away as possible.

But that doesn't even matter. Hyper-jumping at lower levels usually never puts a lowbie out of your client range because it's not a max level HJ, so in other words, wouldn't get affected at all.

-EDIT

And Pylat, about those Agents, I'm honestly not sure. I think they despawn *because* they are out of range, but then I have that side of me that says, "What's the point of having level 100 Agent spawns when you just HJ at the first sight you see of them?" I mean we all know of the complaining that's been going on about them, so meh. Maybe this would only happen if the PvP Flag was up?

I agree, the only problem being if the vertical height is reduced too much you may not be able to evade agents as easily, cause you can't reach the necessary height to get them to despawn.

What I was disagreeing to was certain people saying it should be nerfed in combat state, but that carries PvE consequences aswell, something a lot of lvl 50's completely forget/don't care about.