The Architect's Mistake

An interesting thought, but... as the Oracle said, the Architect is bound to perfection, he wouldn't make such a comment without a good reason. Maybe he already realized the threat coming from Smith and considered Neo the only way to stop Smith.

Speculation, merely.

Didn't the Oracle say something along the lines of "You have the sight now Neo" when they met during reloaded?

Hmm I'll have to think about this a little more but this is my initial thoughts:


We know that the machines lie on several occasions (ya know, the whole "false reality thing"" />; however, The Architect seems to genuinely be providing a completely fair choice.  The Oracle was created in order to help guide The One.  One has to wonder, would Neo and Trinity have fallen in love if The Oracle hadn't given Trinity her prophecy (same as the vase instance)?  We know The Oracle did something different than she had done in the past, and that clearly led to Neo making his decision the way he did.  The Architect doesn't lead him a particular way because that isn't his function, that is The Oracle's function. 

As far as I understand it, machines/programs are supposed to be incapable of actually telling a lie.  This may have been taken out for the game, but did it ever happen in the trilogy?

That basically goes to the last scene of the 3rd movie between the oracle and the architect.

O: What about the others?

A: What others?

O:  The ones that want out.

A: Obviously they will be freed.

O: I have your word on that?

A: What do you think i am, human?

Pretty sure that is close to the exact wording.  My take on it all is that neo, by that point, would have chosen the door he went through regardless.  He knew that going through the other door would mean the death of every zionite in the real world, including trinity.  He choose the door he went through because, even though he was unsure of how he would do it, he was determined to save the humans.

As far as I understand it, machines/programs are supposed to be incapable of actually telling a lie.  This may have been taken out for the game, but did it ever happen in the trilogy?

The intention of the machines was not lie about the reality, but keep them under their reality. I can't recall any moment when the machines lie.

The Architect gave neo that choice because that's how the humans accept the matrix in first place, with choice. So the Architect made the math and thought that every human in every case needs a choice. Obviously he couldn't forsee that Neo would choose the left door, but the choice was given to keep his own logic.

I disagree.  The intention of the machines seems clearly to me to be to lie to humans about reality.  If a human would have come across an agent and said, "Hey, is this world an illusion?" do you believe the Agent would have said, "Yes"?  No!  The Matrix is a manipulative system of control!  It's obvious Machiavellian principles.  Read Plato's Allegory of the Cave and Descartes theory of radical doubt - those are what the Matrix are clearly based off of.

Someone said the Oracle was created to guide the one. I think her purpose was to relate to humans. I perceived her now as an exile who chooses to guide redpills. Maybe for her own self interest. She needs the Matrix to survive. But who knows her real motivation. I think she is a system of control like Neo suspected. She offers a choice, too. Believe her or not.

As far as the Architect mentioning Trinity, you bring up a good point about Neo not knowing that Trinity was in the Matrix and in danger. If Neo had chosen to reset the Matrix, wouldn't that have cleared the Smith Virus? The Merovingian survived by hiding in Effie's constructs and then re-entering the Matrix to 'reign', right? So Smith would have just gone down with the ship.

So what reasons could he have for mentioning her?

• integrity (doubt that, but it is possible)
• hatred (it is obvious the best choice is to reset the Matrix. Maybe he just wants Neo to suffer knowing that his love is dying and he must choose to let her die in the interests of the greater number. Though the architect does not display hatred for humans. That was Smith's role.)
• Any other theories?

the architect cannot see past any choice

to him they are varibles to the equation that must be solved and countered.

that is his mistake.

while he was busy, thinking 2 dimensionally with neo, some serious stuff was going down in the simulation. smith was beginning to get his groove on.

he had fragemnts of neo in his programming because of what happened in the first film. he didnt quite understand it but explained it as something overwritten or copied. the bottom line was he is back, unplugged and he has the mind of neo reversed.

neo wants to save humanity

smith wants to destroy humanity

now the architect has 2 problems, binary in nature, opposite of each other

the situation is escalating rapidly. agents are despatched to counter the problem but to no impact

the architect is then faced with the truth to just how these 2 anomalies blindslided him in the ultimate "didnt see this *poop* coming kind of way!"

2 systemic anomalies threatening the system, one is reproducing itself by overwriting everyone it comes into contact with.

all efforts to counter fail in a fashion that produces another anomaly to counter

1000 smiths/1000 agents to counter=2000 smiths

2000 smiths/6000 agents to counter=8000 smiths

see a pattern emerging?

at the end of revolutions, the matrix was completely inhabited by the anomaly. every blue pill, every program was smith

all recources to counter have been depleted.

u have the fields where people are grown but they are not connected to the matrix yet,

mmmm

we know the rest of the story. the architects mistake?

not seeing and countering smith in time was the mistake.

that is my theory anyway

An interesting thought, but... as the Oracle said, the Architect is bound to perfection, he wouldn't make such a comment without a good reason. Maybe he already realized the threat coming from Smith and considered Neo the only way to stop Smith.

Speculation, merely.

The Architect cannot see past any choice. To him they are varibles to the equation that must be solved and countered. That is his mistake.

While he was busy thinking 2 dimensionally with Neo some serious stuff was going down in the simulation. Smith was beginning to get his groove on. We know the rest of the story.

The architects mistake? Not seeing and countering smith in time was the mistake.

mmmm

good question!

i believe that the only way to counter what was going down was to leave it alone... let it play itself out.

the simulation was fubar, i believe every human being in the simulation died

it is my opinion that if the architect is to save machine city, he has to comepletly firewall the simulation. any virtual usb ports that are used as an exit have to be disconnected. we know them as mobil av's.  if smith got out thru a mobil av, it is over!

that is exactly what he did.

he countered the problem by isolating the matrix completely.

allow it to play itself out, which it did,and then restore the simulation with a REWRITING of all code so as to prevent such a situation from happening again.

that is the simulation that we currently find ourselves in.

there are programs running that prevent such a situation from ever happening again.

anyway

that is my opinion, and so ima wait for everyone to post a reply disagreeing with me.

lol

Oh god here we go again

mmmm

good question!

i believe that the only way to counter what was going down was to leave it alone... let it play itself out.

Obviously not because Neo had already been created to be the counter. Smith is the manifestation of the Oracle changing things. Without her doing what she did Smith would never have become as much of a problem as he was. The question isn't how the Architect planned on countering Smith because that wasn't his mistake. The question is how did the Oracle plan on countering Smith which is in plan view.

the simulation was fubar, i believe every human being in the simulation died

So that's why we see the Oracle, Seraph, and Sati alive and well at the end? Smith only overwrote their code he didn't kill his host because a virus can not live without a host.

it is my opinion that if the architect is to save machine city, he has to comepletly firewall the simulation. any virtual usb ports that are used as an exit have to be disconnected. we know them as mobil av's.  if smith got out thru a mobil av, it is over!

that is exactly what he did.

he countered the problem by isolating the matrix completely.

Obviously not sense Neo got back in to fight Smith. Also as Neo tells Deus Ex Machina, the Smith program has grown beyond there control and he will spread throughout the real just as he did the Matrix if not fixed.

allow it to play itself out, which it did,and then restore the simulation with a REWRITING of all code so as to prevent such a situation from happening again.

We don't even see the Architect until the end of revolutions after his meeting with the Oracle and all of your speculation comes from some apparent knowledge you claim to posses to know what he was doing between the times we see him. Its actually much more likely that he was transported out of the Matrix and allowed the Oracle to fix the problem.

that is the simulation that we currently find ourselves in.

there are programs running that prevent such a situation from ever happening again.

No it isn't, we are in the same version the moves were in. Go back and read your other thread as everything you have ever claimed has already been refuted. And obviously not sense the Smith virus has returned twice sense then.

anyway

that is my opinion, and so ima wait for everyone to post a reply disagreeing with me.

lol

lol indeed.

To answer the OPs original question. Yes the Architect was responsible for making Neo choose the door he did. Dreams or not Neo had no way of knowing Trinity was jacked in. Love is not some mystical power that allows one to see what the person they love is doing or feel them. It is just a word used to express feelings one has for another. This goes back to the "Would you still have knocked it over if I hadn't said anything" question the Oracle hits him with the first time he meets her. The answer is no he wouldn't and this one is the same no he would not have picked that door if he never knew Trinity had jacked back in.

Is this a mistake? Can't say as his character leads on that he evaluates everything that happens so he must of had some reason for informing Neo of such.

The Oracle telling him he has the sight only means that he has the power to move faster than time. Time does not bind him like it does you and me and that is why he is able to catch her.

Kybutra wrote:

Oh god here we go again

Hey, as long as he maintains that it is his opinion and not fact as he tends to do, I'm not really too bothered " width="15" height="15" />

oh that iz easy!

sentinals were dispatched to unplug the mobil av's

the general is a sentinal, he and his other sentinals just plug it back in.

and by the way these are my opinions, that is truth. if u can think of better explanation, feel free.

mmmm

if the mobil av's were not unplugged, smith would have got out.

oh btw i hope that no one thinks that because every year we see smith return as being an indication that he did get out for that is not the real smith! yes, it is true, the smith virus can effect u but since it is not catastrophic, that is further truth that programs are in place that prevent it from happening again.

that program called the smith virus is a very weakened version of the original.

that is all

oh btw i hope that no one thinks that because every year we see smith return as being an indication that he did get out for that is not the real smith! yes, it is true, the smith virus can effect u but since it is not catastrophic, that is further truth that programs are in place that prevent it from happening again.

that program called the smith virus is a very weakened version of the original.

that is all

oh that iz easy!

sentinals were dispatched to unplug the mobil av's

the general is a sentinal, he and his other sentinals just plug it back in.

and by the way these are my opinions, that is truth. if u can think of better explanation, feel free.