Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

#36300345237 10/30/2007 05:15:31 Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

Hi,

I'm new to PvP, and I love it. I'm a Duelist and I'm having problems with MKT's. Can any of you Master Duelists provide any tips/strategies. I'm getting rooted and I need states to do my specials, while MKT's don't. I do nice damage, but by the time I get going it's too late. I guess knowing what to attempt 1st would be a good start.

Thanks in advance

#36300345256 10/30/2007 06:09:35 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

Gunmen naturally have a harder time with MKT's, but there are tactics to emply to give yourself a better fighting chance.

1. Adjust your base stats to give you more defense against MKT's.

2. Just because your a duelist, don't mean you can't use abilites from the other gunmen trees, mix it up
i.e Use clamors with SMG to get stuns on the MKT's, various roots from other trees to slow a MKT down.

3. Powerless is your friend, the gunmen tree has a move that has 50% chance to cause this, use as often as possible.

4. Don't try to go simply for states. You seem to be having problems with that, so use more moves that don't require states, pistol aerial, dual pistol execution, disarming shot, covering fire, etc etc.

5. Defense is your friend, learn to use grab and block to their potential, you will find yourself handling a MKt much better.

Just some basic stater tips, as anything, try a few things and see what suits you.

Fighting a MKT in pvp and a duel are 2 different things, so gain experience in both.

#36300345327 10/30/2007 08:36:21 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

Aquatium. wrote:

Gunmen naturally have a harder time with MKT's, but there are tactics to emply to give yourself a better fighting chance.
1. Adjust your base stats to give you more defense against MKT's.
2. Just because your a duelist, don't mean you can't use abilites from the other gunmen trees, mix it up
i.e Use clamors with SMG to get stuns on the MKT's, various roots from other trees to slow a MKT down.
3. Powerless is your friend, the gunmen tree has a move that has 50% chance to cause this, use as often as possible.
4. Don't try to go simply for states. You seem to be having problems with that, so use more moves that don't require states, pistol aerial, dual pistol execution, disarming shot, covering fire, etc etc.
5. Defense is your friend, learn to use grab and block to their potential, you will find yourself handling a MKt much better.
Just some basic stater tips, as anything, try a few things and see what suits you.
Fighting a MKT in pvp and a duel are 2 different things, so gain experience in both.

You might also want to try the dropping of your shield trick. When they cripple you, then go to break your shield so you're a sitting duck for a punt just drop your evade and it catches them off guard giving you maybe one-two free rounds of special v normal roll depending on the persons reactions.

Be smart, use tactics like Aqua said and that will give you the best chance of defeating an MKT with Duelist.

#36300345427 10/30/2007 11:21:17 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

Ya try dropping your shield when they go to break it cause it catches them off guard. Another trick is if they do root you and break your shield. Make sure you have a root too so you can root them. Then just stand there and laugh at them till your root is gone. If you root them close to you they can't put on there disguise either.

#36300345446 10/30/2007 12:09:32 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

Besides all the strategy there are some nifty clothes out there that have thrown def/res AND ballistic acc/dmg bonuses that I hardly see anyone use. Look for a orange/tan roca and a purple yoshi ringbuckle shirt. Shoot, if I could get IG now I could give you the exact name...

#36300345934 10/31/2007 04:29:56 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

Hi,

Thanks for your input, all of you - I was referring to Duel with a MKT - PvP is just crazy and anything can happen from one moment to the next - lol. Aquatium, you are correct, I try to cause a state first; and in the process was unaware that I have moves that don't require a state.

Also, my stats are: Focus/Perception = 30, with remaining in Vitality. The question now is, am I setting my stats correctly. Vitality is awesome; all I know is I flow much smoother and get more specials in.

Yasamuu1, Hanzyl and Gretyl, thanks for the dropping the shield trick and Tenshi, for the input on clothes.

I have an area K, Widows moor and cap;but I'm finding that the dueling is slowly breaking them. I can always get another area k, but I don't think the widows stuff is replacable. So I'm working on getting clothes that can be replaced.

Harpadzo (Ionwind in Syntax server)

#36300346014 10/31/2007 09:48:51 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

The root thing is pretty important i find in a duel. It basically puts things as a stalemate and may delay enough time for you to put your shield back up. They won't want to attack you or they will break the root. You just have to remember not to attack them either. If you can't root them and they have you rooted and shield down switch to block cause the punt or suplex is coming. The thrown hyper is important too. Also anything you can do to interrupt the MKT's inital combo is a good thing.

Additionally you can try using the concealment countermeasures tool now that it supposedly works. I haven't tested it myself though.

#36300346498 11/01/2007 07:48:04 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

Hanzyl and Gretyl wrote:

The root thing is pretty important i find in a duel. It basically puts things as a stalemate and may delay enough time for you to put your shield back up. They won't want to attack you or they will break the root. You just have to remember not to attack them either. If you can't root them and they have you rooted and shield down switch to block cause the punt or suplex is coming. The thrown hyper is important too. Also anything you can do to interrupt the MKT's inital combo is a good thing.

Additionally you can try using the concealment countermeasures tool now that it supposedly works. I haven't tested it myself though.

Ty Hanzyl - experience just spoke - lol. It's as though you were there to witness. Yep, I was rooted and I attacked without bringing up shield 1st, and a punt followed.

So the next thing is interruptions - what/how?

Ionwind

#36300346687 11/01/2007 14:17:12 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

To be perfectly honest, I'd try Expert Rifleman instead - as far as gunmen go. I don't know about on Vector but MKT's on Syntax generally have a clumsy rate of IS consumption so they wear less resistance/more IS regen to make up for this fact.

Put on damage clothing, and try to get a root on your enemy. Move back as soon as possible, and feign like you're going into concealment for a Snipe Shot. Put on Line Up The Shot and immediately put on Firearms Skill afterward, all while using a Halsey Sniper Rifle. They'll most likely think that you were stupid enough to go for a Concealed Shot - and failed - so they'll be range. On power, I estimate your Free fire doing anywhere from 500-800 in duels depending on your opponent's resistance. Chain together a 4 shot combo and use your superior range to keep away from them in the fight and it'll be easycakes.

#36300346831 11/01/2007 19:26:38 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

Grab tactics to take down there shield

Once you have them Interlocked and have Hyper Sense (Level50) loaded, you will have no problem SMILEY

#36300347429 11/03/2007 08:44:45 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

Those who have already made comments have brought up some of the best strategies for you to use as a Gunner fighting against MKT's. However, as a habitual user of the Gunslinger loadout, I will do my best to add to the conversation.

You can approach this in one or two ways...

You can go up against a Master Knife Thrower using a pure Duelist load OR you can go up against them using a hybrid load. If you're using a pure Duelist load, you're going to be at a disadvantage from the start. The reason being you're primarily going to be relying on your Handgun style whereas you'd probably find that a mixed/hybrid loadout is going to enable you to use something more appropriate for defense AND damage, such as Rifle style. Handguns offer decent defense for an IL build, but it's Rifles that gives you the ability to dish out more damage while taking fewer hits - allowing for a better chance to land a state on your opponent.

In fact, you may want to work with a Rifleman hybrid - favoring it over Gunslinger and Scattershot - to make for the most effective hybrid gunner load in PvP. The reason being you have more of a chance to shutdown the MKT outside of interlock using Powerless, Stun, and Root abilities to get them low on health and scrambling before the interlock begins. In addition, because you'll be acquiring a higher accuracy buff and adding to the accuracy if you mix multiple gunner trees, you can dedicate the remainder of your resources (read: clothes) towards resistances and defense. While gearing towards resistance for Thrown is feasible in a duel, you may not be able to protect yourself effectively against more than two damage types if you're in open group PvP.

Still, you can run around with only one piece of Ballistic Accuracy clothing and the rest can be dedicated towards various defenses and resistances - you'll still do well if you have 30 in your Accuracy attribute and at least 25 in your Damage attribute. Pump the rest of your points into Reason or Vitality, but make no mistake: you will NEVER be able to get your Thrown defense as high as a MKT will be able to pump their Ballistic defense. Same as a Martial Artist fighting you as a Gunner. Their Ballistic defense will never be as high as your Melee defense, due to the way stats are arranged. For this reason you will want to fall on the DPS philosophy of reducing the amount of hurt you're getting dealt, because nothing you do will dramatically affect the random Accuracy/Defense.

Shield Trick = It's been mentioned several times above. While I'd rather not use this trick as it leaves you vulnerable, it's still a worthy tactic. You can also use the Tactics to your advantage. If you're rooted, immediately do one of two things: Switch to green and hit their shield or switch to yellow and let them bounce off of yours before you follow-up with green to attempt breaking theirs. It will be a race to see who can get their opponent's shield down.

Calm Mind, Calm Body = Influences your Resistance for a short time, but this is essential to surviving the aftermath of a Punt. If it looks like you're going to get Sneak Attacked, turn this on immediately and then apply it each and every time it refreshes while you're in Interlock. Note that it adds excessively to your Resistance, so you may want to wear plenty of Shielded clothes and have a decent Thrown Resistance bonus percentage.

Clothing Assortment = Essential items are Seraphim Shoes, Quicksilver Gloves, and at least one piece of Shielded clothing. The rest of your gear, if buffed, should be close to level 50 to take advantage of the highest resistances as possible. Expirement with high-level gear that has Thrown Resistance percentages, if not 30+ points of Resistance already. You may even want to omit the Quicksilvers if you can find gloves with a higher Thrown resistance - considering what I said above still stands. Thrown Defense will pretty much NOT help you.

Prison Mentality Device = Need I say more? The toughness bonus is very beneficial. Activating this early on will help you to shrug off the Deadly Throw/Sweep combo that usually follows a Punt. Typically, this is what separates the efficient MKT's from the cookie-cutters. Remember to buy yourself more time and stay alive. If you can get enough Resistance and keep yourself alive long enough for them to get low on IS, you'll win in a roll v roll scenario that doesn't involve Specials. Why? Because MKT's have high accuracy by default. Their specials will almost always outroll your specials, so you want to conserve your health and IS so that when they're out of IS - or conserving it - you can outroll their melee attacks.

Rifleman Tree = I already mentioned that this is a great assist. The roots and stuns are great additions to your loadout if you need more freefire attacks. Not to mention if you load the Rifle Butt Smash, you can roll out in much the same way that the MKT would.

#36300347678 11/04/2007 07:24:27 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

code yourself some anti's too, 1.0, 2.0, 3.0, 4.0 or 5.0 are great. They will sweep all the movement debuffs and states off; wear LOTS (at least 180) of thrown resist and there throws will only be doing 200-300 damage MAX! alll you need to worry about is getting there shield down first then, but 8/10 times if they see they can't root you, they will run a mile.

contact me if you want some anti's coded!

#36300347990 11/04/2007 22:54:35 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

heh guess its a good thing i always check sheild up/down before interlock. thank god for the colored crosshaire

#36300348101 11/05/2007 07:49:48 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

Ty ZeroTolerance, Sphairo, SuperStarX, and Marias,

Zero - For your time and patience on clearing things up.

Sphairo - For providing a base number; that really helps in clarifying how much thrown res I should have.

(On a side note Sphairo - I've seen you on Mara C engaged in PvP; lol, You vs many)

SuperStarX - For making me aware of the color of the cross-hair; I was completley unaware of it. Ill begin to check now that I am aware.

Marias - For providing a Loadout/outfit and feign. I stil need to code sniper and get the Halsey sniper rifle. I do have the Expert rifle tree coded but haven't used it much, and the one time I did I used steady aim and the IS drain was a big turn off.

#36300348103 11/05/2007 07:54:29 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

Harpadzo wrote:

Ty ZeroTolerance, Sphairo, SuperStarX, and Marias,
Zero - For your time and patience on clearing things up.
Sphairo - For providing a base number; that really helps in clarifying how much thrown res I should have.
(On a side note Sphairo - I've seen you on Mara C engaged in PvP; lol, You vs many)
SuperStarX - For making me aware of the color of the cross-hair; I was completley unaware of it. Ill begin to check now that I am aware.
Marias - For providing a Loadout/outfit and feign. I stil need to code sniper and get the Halsey sniper rifle. I do have the Expert rifle tree coded but haven't used it much, and the one time I did I used steady aim and the IS drain was a big turn off.

Steady Aim is a giant IS drainer so I seldom use it unless I need the next shot to hit. I'll put it on before a root/powerless and turn it off immediately, in the rare instance that I do activate it.

#36300350476 11/09/2007 10:20:32 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

It's better to wear 180-190 worth of resist clothing because after 200, I don't really see it making any more of a distance, and you should focus on other resists as well as thrown.

Also, to the people who are suggesting you drop your shield before hand.. don't. One thing you'll find out is spy's have about 4 differant moves that break from interlock, they can come and go as they please.. so wasting 40 IS of a shield is not very beneficial at the end of the day. Instead, use the time out of interlock on them to get a state. Inside interlock, MKT will the majority of the time will win the rolls.. so by stating it gives you an advantage if you enter interlock using a full auto redux or point blank on them.

Also, if they are about to punt.. switch to block, put on some watchers shades and maybe even loadup detection.. and you could a) use the conterconcealment tool or b) brave the sneak attack out and hope for the best. There's always c) run/jump/disengage from combat but I'd rather take the first two. :P much more fun.

#36300350688 11/09/2007 14:09:53 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

Also if you enter interlock on them use That interlock ability forget what it's called i don't use it much personally but it's awesome against MKT's because it means they can't roll out for several seconds in which by that time you have already done enough damage to them.

#36300352853 11/14/2007 07:24:31 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

Dual Pistol Dash... causes enrage for a few seconds at the cost of quite a bit of IS...

#36300354252 11/16/2007 05:16:56 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

Also Note People may say seraphim shoes are best out there. But if trying to max resistances or at least some thrown and melee resistance. I have just the pair. Just gota jack in to get the name of the shoes. and there lvl 45 to 50ish shoes so ill get a SShot ina sec

EDIT: K here ya go. I prefer these over seraphim for reasons some say are obsured. But heck least i have all resistances in the triple digits and not one or two being double digits with seraphim's on

#36300354272 11/16/2007 05:56:55 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

I have various resistance based shoes, but seriously Seraphims > All other shoes for pvp.

#36300354329 11/16/2007 08:04:31 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

Aquatium. wrote:

I have various resistance based shoes, but seriously Seraphims > All other shoes for pvp.

'cept the socks, you can't top the Commando socks versus guns or mkt in PvP SMILEY

Also, since enrage now finally actually helps you preventing them from rolling out, use e.g. controlled burst, sidekick and so on. On another sidenote, MKTs will now much more use Canny Strike if they can, 'cause it's got the highest acc bonus for a combat-ability in-game.

#36300356284 11/20/2007 13:51:42 Re:Need help with Duelist strategy vs. MKT

GoDGiVeR wrote:

Aquatium. wrote:
I have various resistance based shoes, but seriously Seraphims > All other shoes for pvp.

'cept the socks, you can't top the Commando socks versus guns or mkt in PvP " />

Also, since enrage now finally actually helps you preventing them from rolling out, use e.g. controlled burst, sidekick and so on. On another sidenote, MKTs will now much more use Canny Strike if they can, 'cause it's got the highest acc bonus for a combat-ability in-game.

Canny strike has a horrible IS cost and you have to load useless abilities to get to it. I'll stick with Side Roll, and still roll out 80% of the time.