[8.1.5] How we can really fight the Machines - Syntax - 8/20/07

GoDGiVeR wrote:

((There is no place in the game which can't be penetrated to eavesdroping. Even the org-constructs can be penetrated to listen. Being able to listen through walls is a -quite- bad aspect of RP in this game))

You're quite right about there being no real protection against eavesdropping in the game--even to the extent of players copying and pasting snippets of private team chat to their RL buddies, etc. In theory I could try to maximize potential privacy by holding all such meetings in extremely remote places like org areas, or low-level PVP constructs, but that 1) is a real pain to set up all the time and 2) would quickly become repetitive and boring. So the reality of the situation is that "private" event meetings will be sometimes be held in less remote locations that are still not just on the street, such as inside or on top of buildings, and the story will still assume that they are "private," unless eavesdropping is specifically called for by the story (which is very rare).

I'm not sure in what way you intended "bad aspect of RP" to be taken; my own feeling is that those who really wish to RP will respect the "privacy" role-play of other groups by playing along with the idea that their conversation really was private; ie "bad RP" would be trying to role-play with information gained by taking advantage of the game's mechanical limitations in preventing eavesdropping, while "good RP" would not make direct use of such information. I tend to be of the opinion that genuine "role-play" does require a good deal of "playing along" with the communal story in order to realize its full potential.

You make a lot of good points. And yes, there is very few to almost no places in the Matrix that allow absolute subtlety from the random eavesdropper. I respect other people's events by either standing off to the side or in sneak when I can, mostly because I don't want to ruin the fun for others in my opinion. Why? Because it's sort of annoying having people from different Orgs show for when it comes time for your Org's event and spam/voice their opinion when it really isn't needed or wanted. As for the RP side of it, there are a lot of different factors as to what you consider Bad and Good RP. I've seen LESIG reference the LE Events board, which considering every LE is posted here, "secrecy" sort of flies out the window. Granted, you can't do much about that except for maybe screenshot limitation. Of course, there are other things that happen behind the scenes like the current Unidentified Broadcast that is revolving around the Joker. There's a lot of scale to it considering you have public forum boards that in some cases are taken IC, other cases OOC.

Then again, I suppose this board is sort of a, "Heh, look what I did here." sort of ideal. Perhaps a way that the LE characters can show to their opposers and allies that they may or may have not accomplished something, as well as another way of accomplishing the goal of making the storyline accessible to everyone. I only think that mostly because the LE threads are posted by the LE characters in an IC format.

So, overall, I guess it's sort of hard to consider what is considered bad RP or good RP in a matter of sense concerning "secret meetings". Who knows, maybe an unsuspecting redpill stumbles upon a meeting sworn to secrecy. Or maybe they got the information from a snitch from the hosting organization. I would consider that decent RP. What I wouldn't consider good RP is the people who are OOC about it. The people who show up and don't give a *CENSORED* about other people. The way like a cancer spreads through someone's body, the way words from some person's faction just looking to grieve others of their fun in a game. It's rather pathetic and annoying in their intertwined ways.

So yeah, that's my opinion. >_>

Oh, P.S. May the Ask A Dev Thread live again? :O

GoDGiVeR wrote:

((There is no place in the game which can't be penetrated to eavesdroping. Even the org-constructs can be penetrated to listen. Being able to listen through walls is a -quite- bad aspect of RP in this game))

You're quite right about there being no real protection against eavesdropping in the game--even to the extent of players copying and pasting snippets of private team chat to their RL buddies, etc. In theory I could try to maximize potential privacy by holding all such meetings in extremely remote places like org areas, or low-level PVP constructs, but that 1) is a real pain to set up all the time and 2) would quickly become repetitive and boring. So the reality of the situation is that "private" event meetings will be sometimes be held in less remote locations that are still not just on the street, such as inside or on top of buildings, and the story will still assume that they are "private," unless eavesdropping is specifically called for by the story (which is very rare).

I'm not sure in what way you intended "bad aspect of RP" to be taken; my own feeling is that those who really wish to RP will respect the "privacy" role-play of other groups by playing along with the idea that their conversation really was private; ie "bad RP" would be trying to role-play with information gained by taking advantage of the game's mechanical limitations in preventing eavesdropping, while "good RP" would not make direct use of such information. I tend to be of the opinion that genuine "role-play" does require a good deal of "playing along" with the communal story in order to realize its full potential.

GoDGiVeR wrote:

((There is no place in the game which can't be penetrated to eavesdroping. Even the org-constructs can be penetrated to listen. Being able to listen through walls is a -quite- bad aspect of RP in this game))

You're quite right about there being no real protection against eavesdropping in the game--even to the extent of players copying and pasting snippets of private team chat to their RL buddies, etc. In theory I could try to maximize potential privacy by holding all such meetings in extremely remote places like org areas, or low-level PVP constructs, but that 1) is a real pain to set up all the time and 2) would quickly become repetitive and boring. So the reality of the situation is that "private" event meetings will be sometimes be held in less remote locations that are still not just on the street, such as inside or on top of buildings, and the story will still assume that they are "private," unless eavesdropping is specifically called for by the story (which is very rare).

I'm not sure in what way you intended "bad aspect of RP" to be taken; my own feeling is that those who really wish to RP will respect the "privacy" role-play of other groups by playing along with the idea that their conversation really was private; ie "bad RP" would be trying to role-play with information gained by taking advantage of the game's mechanical limitations in preventing eavesdropping, while "good RP" would not make direct use of such information. I tend to be of the opinion that genuine "role-play" does require a good deal of "playing along" with the communal story in order to realize its full potential.

Rarebit wrote:

GoDGiVeR wrote:

((There is no place in the game which can't be penetrated to eavesdroping. Even the org-constructs can be penetrated to listen. Being able to listen through walls is a -quite- bad aspect of RP in this game))

You're quite right about there being no real protection against eavesdropping in the game--even to the extent of players copying and pasting snippets of private team chat to their RL buddies, etc. In theory I could try to maximize potential privacy by holding all such meetings in extremely remote places like org areas, or low-level PVP constructs, but that 1) is a real pain to set up all the time and 2) would quickly become repetitive and boring. So the reality of the situation is that "private" event meetings will be sometimes be held in less remote locations that are still not just on the street, such as inside or on top of buildings, and the story will still assume that they are "private," unless eavesdropping is specifically called for by the story (which is very rare).

I'm not sure in what way you intended "bad aspect of RP" to be taken; my own feeling is that those who really wish to RP will respect the "privacy" role-play of other groups by playing along with the idea that their conversation really was private; ie "bad RP" would be trying to role-play with information gained by taking advantage of the game's mechanical limitations in preventing eavesdropping, while "good RP" would not make direct use of such information. I tend to be of the opinion that genuine "role-play" does require a good deal of "playing along" with the communal story in order to realize its full potential.

((

Uhh...what about utilizing the area crash barriers? I haven't seen them since the Monolith days, but I remember having walls that would send one bouncing when they tried to go into specific neighborhoods; it also ended up closing down the hardlines. Anyway to utilize said fix feature into a dev power that can grant protection against eavesdroppers?

))

Tsurai wrote:

Rarebit wrote:

GoDGiVeR wrote:

((There is no place in the game which can't be penetrated to eavesdroping. Even the org-constructs can be penetrated to listen. Being able to listen through walls is a -quite- bad aspect of RP in this game))

You're quite right about there being no real protection against eavesdropping in the game--even to the extent of players copying and pasting snippets of private team chat to their RL buddies, etc. In theory I could try to maximize potential privacy by holding all such meetings in extremely remote places like org areas, or low-level PVP constructs, but that 1) is a real pain to set up all the time and 2) would quickly become repetitive and boring. So the reality of the situation is that "private" event meetings will be sometimes be held in less remote locations that are still not just on the street, such as inside or on top of buildings, and the story will still assume that they are "private," unless eavesdropping is specifically called for by the story (which is very rare).

I'm not sure in what way you intended "bad aspect of RP" to be taken; my own feeling is that those who really wish to RP will respect the "privacy" role-play of other groups by playing along with the idea that their conversation really was private; ie "bad RP" would be trying to role-play with information gained by taking advantage of the game's mechanical limitations in preventing eavesdropping, while "good RP" would not make direct use of such information. I tend to be of the opinion that genuine "role-play" does require a good deal of "playing along" with the communal story in order to realize its full potential.

((

Uhh...what about utilizing the area crash barriers? I haven't seen them since the Monolith days, but I remember having walls that would send one bouncing when they tried to go into specific neighborhoods; it also ended up closing down the hardlines. Anyway to utilize said fix feature into a dev power that can grant protection against eavesdroppers?

))

((actually, you bounce off because the region-server hosting those neighbourhoods is down while the rest of the game is running. That's why you aren't allowed to transit there (no hardlines, either) because the area does not exist! I doubt that they can reproduce the effect without major compromise. Also, you can't stay inside this barrier, which makes a usage for meetings, futile and from a logical standpoint, shutting down a whole area would just mark the attention to the Machines AND the bluepills alike.
And btw, it happened in cr2 once when I was on ^^))

Travi wrote:

Speak for yourself there, Neonite. It takes people who have worked for the Machines to realize what they can offer and what they can do for the ones who work for them, as well what we can do for them. You act like you've worked for them before, which is highly doubtful - seeing as how your wearing the EPN tag and following The Kid like a lost pup in trying to defend your Zion counterparts in a broken Truce that YOUR deity brokered to make sure we wouldn't have to fight anymore. Neo brokered that Truce for everyone one, but Zion spit on it. You're choice.
- I'm not about to argue with who's right and who's wrong in this conflict. I only wished to state that it takes one who has worked for the Machines to realize what it's like. From what I draw, Zion never wanted the Truce and only used it as an excuse to build the new city.
But oh well, have it your way. And oh, not just the Sentinels...expect us out there too. We have hovercraft, they're armed and armored, as well as, manned by skilled crews that are apt at using gun turrets.

(( Sidenote: Expect you there too? Since when do the machines allow any hovercrafts, even machinists in? If I missed something, fill me in. Otherwise, the fact that the machinists can't go near the city could only be used to further my IC argument about how the machines are just using machinists >.> ))

Our ancestors tried that.  It didn't work.

Illyria